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#11
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Where can I buy cerium oxide glass polishing powder?
"Beveled Glass Arts" wrote in message s.com... Mike, Greetings from the future! Although the last posting to this thread was in 2004 I thought I would share some of my own experiences regarding polishing powder for hand beveled glass with other bevelers who may have similar questions and will more then likely come across this discussion when they do a search on this subject. In 1979 one of the glass shops where I was working as a beveler, we used Rareox 90 on a Somaca polishing machine with a 24" X 3" medium hard woolfelt ring with good results. We got the polishing powder from Sommer & Maca. After a short stint with this company I went on my own supplying stained glass shops in the Salt Lake City area with custom beveled glass. I used Rareox 90 for a couple of years thinking I was using some really good polishing powder and compared to Rareox 45 it was. One day I was speaking to a sales rep from Salem Distributing located in North Carolina. He told me about Cerox 1670 and that it was specifically made for hand polishing of beveled glass. I tried some and couldn't believe the difference. It wasn't just a small difference, it was like night and day. I've been using it ever since. Over the years I've tried many different polishing powders but nothing even comes close. Salem Distributing's Quest 90 also does a good job and is much less expensive then Cerox 1670. Get samples from Salem and see what you think. Cheers, Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com I see Quest 98 listed on their website, and a Quest 76, but no 90, did you perhaps do a typo, or do they have one that is not listed? and how did you find the Cerox as far as how long it lasts. I see a 20 kg pail, which in my experience lasts a long , long time, I think several years, if it is really efficient material, I would expect it to outlast the rareOx 90? what was your experience in that regard? My only reference would also be with Somaca material...if there is something better, I want it. |
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#12
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Where can I buy cerium oxide glass polishing powder?
On Aug 7, 11:46 am, "glassguy" wrote:
"Beveled Glass Arts" wrote in legroups.com... Mike, Greetings from the future! Although the last posting to this thread was in 2004 I thought I would share some of my own experiences regarding polishing powder for hand beveled glass with other bevelers who may have similar questions and will more then likely come across this discussion when they do a search on this subject. In 1979 one of the glass shops where I was working as a beveler, we used Rareox 90 on a Somaca polishing machine with a 24" X 3" medium hard woolfelt ring with good results. We got the polishing powder from Sommer & Maca. After a short stint with this company I went on my own supplying stained glass shops in the Salt Lake City area with custom beveled glass. I used Rareox 90 for a couple of years thinking I was using some really good polishing powder and compared to Rareox 45 it was. One day I was speaking to a sales rep from Salem Distributing located in North Carolina. He told me about Cerox 1670 and that it was specifically made for hand polishing of beveled glass. I tried some and couldn't believe the difference. It wasn't just a small difference, it was like night and day. I've been using it ever since. Over the years I've tried many different polishing powders but nothing even comes close. Salem Distributing's Quest 90 also does a good job and is much less expensive then Cerox 1670. Get samples from Salem and see what you think. Cheers, Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com I see Quest 98 listed on their website, and a Quest 76, but no 90, did you perhaps do a typo, or do they have one that is not listed? and how did you find the Cerox as far as how long it lasts. I see a 20 kg pail, which in my experience lasts a long , long time, I think several years, if it is really efficient material, I would expect it to outlast the rareOx 90? what was your experience in that regard? My only reference would also be with Somaca material...if there is something better, I want it. I talked to Bob Datz at Salem Dist. yesterday about this. Evidently The Quest 98 is a new item but they still carry the Quest 90. The difference: Quest 90: Cerium Oxide: 80% - 85% Particle Size: .7 - .9 Microns Suspension: Yes Price: $224 for 20 Kilogram Pail Quest 98: Cerium Oxide: 98% - 99% Particle Size: .6 - .8 Microns Suspension: No Price: $292 for 20 Kilogram Pail Cerox 1670 Cerium Oxide: 65% Particle Size: 1.0 - 2.0 Microns Suspension: No Price: $489 for 20 Kilogram Pail Looks like the choice would be between the Quest 98 and the Cerox 1670. Although the Quest 98 has a smaller particle size than the Quest 90, I think the higher concentration of cerium would make for quicker polishing plus a brighter polish. The difference in price between the 90 and 98 is so small that it is a non issue. As you can see by the particle size comparison the Cerox 1670 is about twice as course as the Quest products. Although the concentration of cerium is less, it is much more aggressive. This is especially noticeable when doing scratch polishing. If you're doing freehand beveled glass the Cerox 1670 would probably be the better choice. As for your mileage, that all depends on the way you bevel. I know of a beveler that uses 3F to pre-polish. He spends more time on the cork wheel but only has to touch the bevel on the felt. His reasoning is that a pound of pumice is cheaper then a pound of cerium. Good point! Your pre-polish has a big bearing on how much time you spend polishing. If you think you are spending to much time polishing maybe you need to take a look at the way your machines are set up or your procedures. For instance, without you telling me anything about your setup or procedures I can tell you that your SFPM (surface feet per minute) on your pre-polish and polishing wheels are probably wrong. You're probably running to fast on your cork and to slow on your felt. As for my mileage, the Cerox has lasted up to five years mixed at around 5 degrees baume'. At the rate I'm using my pail of Quest 90 it will probably last about two years give or take, mixed at around 7 degrees baume'. With the Rareox 90 it's hard to say. it's been over twenty years since I've used it and since then everything about the way I bevel has changed so it wouldn't be a fair comparison anyway. Give Salem Dist. a call at (800) 234-1982. I talked to Bob Datz at extension 231 but any of the sales reps will be able to help you out. A sample of the Quest 98 is $35 for 5 pounds, a sample of Cerox 1670 is $28 for 1KG (2.2 pounds). Let us know how it works out. Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com |
#13
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Where can I buy cerium oxide glass polishing powder?
On Aug 10, 1:17 pm, Beveled Glass Arts
wrote: On Aug 7, 11:46 am, "glassguy" wrote: "Beveled Glass Arts" wrote in legroups.com... Mike, Greetings from the future! Although the last posting to this thread was in 2004 I thought I would share some of my own experiences regarding polishing powder for hand beveled glass with other bevelers who may have similar questions and will more then likely come across this discussion when they do a search on this subject. In 1979 one of the glass shops where I was working as a beveler, we used Rareox 90 on a Somaca polishing machine with a 24" X 3" medium hard woolfelt ring with good results. We got the polishing powder from Sommer & Maca. After a short stint with this company I went on my own supplying stained glass shops in the Salt Lake City area with custom beveled glass. I used Rareox 90 for a couple of years thinking I was using some really good polishing powder and compared to Rareox 45 it was. One day I was speaking to a sales rep from Salem Distributing located in North Carolina. He told me about Cerox 1670 and that it was specifically made for hand polishing of beveled glass. I tried some and couldn't believe the difference. It wasn't just a small difference, it was like night and day. I've been using it ever since. Over the years I've tried many different polishing powders but nothing even comes close. Salem Distributing's Quest 90 also does a good job and is much less expensive then Cerox 1670. Get samples from Salem and see what you think. Cheers, Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com I see Quest 98 listed on their website, and a Quest 76, but no 90, did you perhaps do a typo, or do they have one that is not listed? and how did you find the Cerox as far as how long it lasts. I see a 20 kg pail, which in my experience lasts a long , long time, I think several years, if it is really efficient material, I would expect it to outlast the rareOx 90? what was your experience in that regard? My only reference would also be with Somaca material...if there is something better, I want it. I talked to Bob Datz at Salem Dist. yesterday about this. Evidently The Quest 98 is a new item but they still carry the Quest 90. The difference: Quest 90: Cerium Oxide: 80% - 85% Particle Size: .7 - .9 Microns Suspension: Yes Price: $224 for 20 Kilogram Pail Quest 98: Cerium Oxide: 98% - 99% Particle Size: .6 - .8 Microns Suspension: No Price: $292 for 20 Kilogram Pail Cerox 1670 Cerium Oxide: 65% Particle Size: 1.0 - 2.0 Microns Suspension: No Price: $489 for 20 Kilogram Pail Looks like the choice would be between the Quest 98 and the Cerox 1670. Although the Quest 98 has a smaller particle size than the Quest 90, I think the higher concentration of cerium would make for quicker polishing plus a brighter polish. The difference in price between the 90 and 98 is so small that it is a non issue. As you can see by the particle size comparison the Cerox 1670 is about twice as course as the Quest products. Although the concentration of cerium is less, it is much more aggressive. This is especially noticeable when doing scratch polishing. If you're doing freehand beveled glass the Cerox 1670 would probably be the better choice. As for your mileage, that all depends on the way you bevel. I know of a beveler that uses 3F to pre-polish. He spends more time on the cork wheel but only has to touch the bevel on the felt. His reasoning is that a pound of pumice is cheaper then a pound of cerium. Good point! Your pre-polish has a big bearing on how much time you spend polishing. If you think you are spending to much time polishing maybe you need to take a look at the way your machines are set up or your procedures. For instance, without you telling me anything about your setup or procedures I can tell you that your SFPM (surface feet per minute) on your pre-polish and polishing wheels are probably wrong. You're probably running to fast on your cork and to slow on your felt. As for my mileage, the Cerox has lasted up to five years mixed at around 5 degrees baume'. At the rate I'm using my pail of Quest 90 it will probably last about two years give or take, mixed at around 7 degrees baume'. With the Rareox 90 it's hard to say. it's been over twenty years since I've used it and since then everything about the way I bevel has changed so it wouldn't be a fair comparison anyway. Give Salem Dist. a call at (800) 234-1982. I talked to Bob Datz at extension 231 but any of the sales reps will be able to help you out. A sample of the Quest 98 is $35 for 5 pounds, a sample of Cerox 1670 is $28 for 1KG (2.2 pounds). Let us know how it works out. Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Artshttp://www.beveledglassarts.com I forgot to mention, Bob said you wouldn't have to open an account to buy the samples Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com |
#14
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Where can I buy cerium oxide glass polishing powder?
On Aug 10, 1:17 pm, Beveled Glass Arts
wrote: On Aug 7, 11:46 am, "glassguy" wrote: "Beveled Glass Arts" wrote in legroups.com... Mike, Greetings from the future! Although the last posting to this thread was in 2004 I thought I would share some of my own experiences regarding polishing powder for hand beveled glass with other bevelers who may have similar questions and will more then likely come across this discussion when they do a search on this subject. In 1979 one of the glass shops where I was working as a beveler, we used Rareox 90 on a Somaca polishing machine with a 24" X 3" medium hard woolfelt ring with good results. We got the polishing powder from Sommer & Maca. After a short stint with this company I went on my own supplying stained glass shops in the Salt Lake City area with custom beveled glass. I used Rareox 90 for a couple of years thinking I was using some really good polishing powder and compared to Rareox 45 it was. One day I was speaking to a sales rep from Salem Distributing located in North Carolina. He told me about Cerox 1670 and that it was specifically made for hand polishing of beveled glass. I tried some and couldn't believe the difference. It wasn't just a small difference, it was like night and day. I've been using it ever since. Over the years I've tried many different polishing powders but nothing even comes close. Salem Distributing's Quest 90 also does a good job and is much less expensive then Cerox 1670. Get samples from Salem and see what you think. Cheers, Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com I see Quest 98 listed on their website, and a Quest 76, but no 90, did you perhaps do a typo, or do they have one that is not listed? and how did you find the Cerox as far as how long it lasts. I see a 20 kg pail, which in my experience lasts a long , long time, I think several years, if it is really efficient material, I would expect it to outlast the rareOx 90? what was your experience in that regard? My only reference would also be with Somaca material...if there is something better, I want it. I talked to Bob Datz at Salem Dist. yesterday about this. Evidently The Quest 98 is a new item but they still carry the Quest 90. The difference: Quest 90: Cerium Oxide: 80% - 85% Particle Size: .7 - .9 Microns Suspension: Yes Price: $224 for 20 Kilogram Pail Quest 98: Cerium Oxide: 98% - 99% Particle Size: .6 - .8 Microns Suspension: No Price: $292 for 20 Kilogram Pail Cerox 1670 Cerium Oxide: 65% Particle Size: 1.0 - 2.0 Microns Suspension: No Price: $489 for 20 Kilogram Pail Looks like the choice would be between the Quest 98 and the Cerox 1670. Although the Quest 98 has a smaller particle size than the Quest 90, I think the higher concentration of cerium would make for quicker polishing plus a brighter polish. The difference in price between the 90 and 98 is so small that it is a non issue. As you can see by the particle size comparison the Cerox 1670 is about twice as course as the Quest products. Although the concentration of cerium is less, it is much more aggressive. This is especially noticeable when doing scratch polishing. If you're doing freehand beveled glass the Cerox 1670 would probably be the better choice. As for your mileage, that all depends on the way you bevel. I know of a beveler that uses 3F to pre-polish. He spends more time on the cork wheel but only has to touch the bevel on the felt. His reasoning is that a pound of pumice is cheaper then a pound of cerium. Good point! Your pre-polish has a big bearing on how much time you spend polishing. If you think you are spending to much time polishing maybe you need to take a look at the way your machines are set up or your procedures. For instance, without you telling me anything about your setup or procedures I can tell you that your SFPM (surface feet per minute) on your pre-polish and polishing wheels are probably wrong. You're probably running to fast on your cork and to slow on your felt. As for my mileage, the Cerox has lasted up to five years mixed at around 5 degrees baume'. At the rate I'm using my pail of Quest 90 it will probably last about two years give or take, mixed at around 7 degrees baume'. With the Rareox 90 it's hard to say. it's been over twenty years since I've used it and since then everything about the way I bevel has changed so it wouldn't be a fair comparison anyway. Give Salem Dist. a call at (800) 234-1982. I talked to Bob Datz at extension 231 but any of the sales reps will be able to help you out. A sample of the Quest 98 is $35 for 5 pounds, a sample of Cerox 1670 is $28 for 1KG (2.2 pounds). Let us know how it works out. Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Artshttp://www.beveledglassarts.com A few posts ago glassguy mentioned that he had found the Quest 98 polishing powder on Salem Distributing's web site which I was not aware of. After talking to Bob Datz at Salem I figured I better check it out and ordered a 5 pound sample (and a new catalog) to compare against the Quest 90 and Cerox 1670 that I am currently using . After a fair evaluation period I concluded that what I had said in a previous post was spot on. I said "Looks like the choice would be between the Quest 98 and the Cerox1670. Although the Quest 98 has a smaller particle size than the Quest90, I think the higher concentration of cerium would make for quicker polishing plus a brighter polish. The difference in price between the 90 and 98 is so small that it is a non issue. As you can see by the particle size comparison the Cerox 1670 is about twice as course as the Quest products. Although the concentration of cerium is less, it is much more aggressive. This is especially noticeable when doing scratch polishing. If you're doing freehand beveled glass the Cerox 1670 would probably be the better choice." A few other thoughts: Although the Quest 98 is not suspension treated the particles do stay suspended much longer the Cerox 1670. The type of polishing wheel (synthetic vs. wool felt and wheel hardness) has a noticeable effect of the polishing brightness of The Cerox 1670 polish. I wanted to order a sample of the Cerox 1630 but they were out of it. The Cerox 1630 is the suspension treated version of the Cerox 1670. The 1670 separates very quickly. It's very annoying when I have to stir the solution every time I dip my brush, when you're polishing all day those few extra seconds spent stirring the solution really add up. Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com |
#15
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Where can I buy cerium oxide glass polishing powder?
Snipped to conserve space:
A few posts ago glassguy mentioned that he had found the Quest 98 polishing powder on Salem Distributing's web site which I was not aware of. After talking to Bob Datz at Salem I figured I better check it out and ordered a 5 pound sample (and a new catalog) to compare against the Quest 90 and Cerox 1670 that I am currently using . After a fair evaluation period I concluded that what I had said in a previous post was spot on. I said "Looks like the choice would be between the Quest 98 and the Cerox1670. Although the Quest 98 has a smaller particle size than the Quest90, I think the higher concentration of cerium would make for quicker polishing plus a brighter polish. The difference in price between the 90 and 98 is so small that it is a non issue. As you can see by the particle size comparison the Cerox 1670 is about twice as course as the Quest products. Although the concentration of cerium is less, it is much more aggressive. This is especially noticeable when doing scratch polishing. If you're doing freehand beveled glass the Cerox 1670 would probably be the better choice." A few other thoughts: Although the Quest 98 is not suspension treated the particles do stay suspended much longer the Cerox 1670. The type of polishing wheel (synthetic vs. wool felt and wheel hardness) has a noticeable effect of the polishing brightness of The Cerox 1670 polish. I wanted to order a sample of the Cerox 1630 but they were out of it. The Cerox 1630 is the suspension treated version of the Cerox 1670. The 1670 separates very quickly. It's very annoying when I have to stir the solution every time I dip my brush, when you're polishing all day those few extra seconds spent stirring the solution really add up. Timothy Trent Beveled Glass Arts http://www.beveledglassarts.com I did order the samples from Salem, great people by the way, although I must say, call them and find out who the local sales rep is, their website could use updating in that area. I dealt with Beth Brown at the NC office and she was great. I ordered the 1670, (they are out) and the Qwest98W (w for white). She was kind enough to send the 98 and some stuff called Freedom White, ( one kilo bottle, sent it free thank you very much), then this week I got, surprise, another pail sample,(paid for. ) of a Cerium called Super OX, I am going to have to call and ask her about details on these items and how they compare, because I have no idea. I don't keep track of, nor does it matter to me, all the numbers involved as Tim does. Maybe I should do that, but what I keep track of his how it works for me in my shop and with my wheels. I wouldn't know how to mix it in a particular "baume" if I had to, I dump it in a pail, add water, make a slurry that sticks to the wheel, (wool felt wheel, I think?) and go. I put the cerium on the wheel with a wet sponge? Is there another way? Perhaps this will bring up alot of differences of operating on a beveling machine. To my knowledge, there are a couple of books out on beveling, and neither of them cover it as well as it could be, but then I am not a writer or a critic, I am a glass worker. I do not do just beveling, I do a great many things in my studio, by offering variety of services, it keeps me in business when the retail supply store just closed up shop. My time on the machines MUST be maximized, so when I saw the post that Tim made, I decided to spend some dough and check it out. I will say for comparison, that the Freedom White, the Qwest 98, and the SuperOX are all relatively close in price, with the Qwest being a bit less 5 lbs @ $35 versus 2 Kilos @ $28, but pretty close. As far as use........ So far I have tried the Freedom White, and I will say the results are far better than what I experienced with a similar product from Somaca and CRL. I have some beveling to do today and will try out the Qwest, let you know how it goes. another point to make in these posts. Tim and I traded an email, my first I stated to him that I wasn't going to post much about this because there weren't many bevellers on this NG. He felt the conversation would be beneficial and out live the both of us,( well, I don't know about you, Tim, but I am living forever). As long as the derogatory and negative language stays out of this, then I will continue to relate my experiences with these products, and how I use them and how they work for me. If it becomes a bash fest/ flame war, then to hell with it, not worth my time. If it helps someone else, good, if it doesn't, Oh well. |
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