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#21
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Karen C - California wrote:
So don't let your community tell you they "can't afford" this sort of program. What they really mean is that they can't be bothered to make the arrangements. I agree. Dianne |
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#22
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Message for animaux
From: Cheryl Isaak .... But I will continue to skip the opera - those poor singers can sound like they are in such pain. LOL I am not "into" what I call heavy opera -- Wagner and such. I DO like light opera -- Gilbert & Sullivan for instance and just about any type of choral (sp?) programmes. I'm not sure if my dislike of "heavy opera" is because I don't understand it (language barriers and all that) or just because it sounds so melodramatic. then again, I have never attended any "heavy opera" performances and that might have something to do with it. I should imagine if you can *see* what is going on during the performanc, it would make it more easily understood and hence be more enjoyable. Of course, ANY Bugs Bunny or Daffy performance that includes "heavy opera" IS imminently enjoyable and quite acceptable to my way of thinking :-)))! CiaoMeow ^;;^ .. PAX, Tia Mary ^;;^ Queen of Kitties Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their WHISKERS!! Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs! |
#23
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Cheryl Isaak wrote:
To my comment:Yes, as a member of society I DO have a direct concern for the education of children in my community. Cheryl opined: I don't happen to agree with you, I don't get into the "it takes a village" thing which takes away parental responsibility and gives it to group that has agendas that I don't agree with. BUT since you are so concerned run for school board, join the PTA or other wise get involved! Don't just complain, do something. Offer free piano lessons at the school or give a concert. I don't know of literacy program that has enough help. the "village" approach: And you think parents with children IN school don't have agendas that are self-serving? To answer your last statement: If you lived here, and lived in my shoes, you'd understand why that's not possible. I have never been a person to just "complain". I have ALWAYS been very active - including school boards and a major landscape restructuring for an entire town. Loads of volunteer time. Until we came here. What exits with in a reasonable distance? Remember, school starts at A. The soonest the buses can leave is 10 minutes later. Then the drive down and factor in lunch time and the drive back. And time to return to classrooms and getting back on the bus to go home at B. And a fudge factor for traffic... How much of the day is left to see anything? Taking children out of the classroom to visit Lambeau Field isn't a field trip of any educational importance. So, if the district is so poor they can't afford something of cultural or educational merit, they should sit in a classroom and listen to a concert, opera, read books on art . . . whatever. Ok - since you aren't "sports minded" how about the food services, the power plant, all the behind the scenes management. Now THAT impresses me and I feel is an important engagement for students. If a district can't afford a trip to a museum, then this is the next best thing. You'll get no argument from me. Then I said: Children, especially children who come from poor, less-culturally advanced areas, need to see museums, symphonies (I think one of the high school clubs DOES go to see a symphony or theatre), etc. etc. If you don't live in poor rural or ghetto areas, then you may not understand what I'm trying to say. To which Cheryl retorted: BULL PUCKY - "culture" is as far away as the internet or the library. You're dreaming. You don't get it. Nor do you understand what I'm trying to say. But if a trip to Lambeau Field sparks something else - an interest in grounds keeping even, then it serves multiple functions. Think outside the box. Oh, an opera or master painting won't inspire anyone, but a trip to Lambeau Field might inspire grounds keeping? I don't mind outside of the box thinking, but rationalization for an agenda that doesn't include real culture??? Dianne |
#24
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#25
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In article , Cheryl Isaak
writes: Turn on the radio. Every Saturday, there's the Texaco Metropolitan Opera broadcast, which is free. You're lucky - Saturdays here are talk shows or the folk/Celtic programs. There is a classical station, but I'd swear it only plays the same few things over and over. KXPR webcasts (www.csus.edu/npr), as does WMUH (http://www.muhlenberg.edu/wmuh/), both of which run the TexMet. The MetOp website has a list of stations and times, so just surf around till you find one with a webcast. Forgot to mention "your local college" as a convenient source of inexpensive culture. City College does plays every semester, CRC is actually the home to a drama competition. Most colleges have orchestras, choirs, etc. Some have art galleries. Call the college(s) and get on the Music Dept, Art Dept, Drama Dept and Chapel mailing lists, and you'll have culture out the yin-yang, most of it free or just a few bucks. "In season", when the senior music majors had to put on a recital, we had several performances a week. I can't play for diddly, but I can read music, so I was on the Music Dept list as a page-turner for the keyboard recitals, and did quite a few. Will work for coffee-and-cake Establish ties with the various departments and you can get cheap bus trips out of the immediate area. Once all the French students had had the opportunity to sign up for the trip to NYC for a French opera, the rest of the seats on the bus were put up for "the college community at large", meaning not only professors, but their friends/relatives/neighbors..... We also had a weekly lecture series -- sometimes our professors, sometimes guest lecturers of note, always educational, and always free. My local ethnic society puts on a number of cultural events every year. Once a month, there's a lecture. In two weeks is a concert by the chorus, and another in February. March has Springfest. Costs me $15 a year to be a member and get the newsletter/calendar, but most events are free. If it's not *your* ethnic group, it's usually no problem to find someone who can enlighten you to the gist of the songs, why there's a filthy chimney sweep wandering around (good luck), what IS this stuff on my plate?! We loooooooooove teaching kids about our culture and history. Network -- someone in your social circle knows someone whose brother plays in the Backstreet Bagpipers, or whose preacher's in-laws run the youth orchestra. A good friend of mine is in the Jazz Society; you tell me what variety of music you want to hear, and after next Sunday's meeting, he'll have phone numbers for you for classical, brass, you name it -- musicians flock together, and the jazz band fiddler may be married to the conductor of Tuba Christmas, or to the lady who teaches Irish step dancing. http://www.spebsqsa.org/ will connect you to a barbershop chorus near you -- again, even if BSQ is not your idea of music, some of their singers will know about Sing-it-Yourself Messiah or madrigals, because they do both. Once you put the word out that you're looking for free concerts, you'll hear about more than you have time for, but it's not something most of us will tell you upfront "Hi, I'm Karen, and if you want to hear Canterbury Tales, my library is reciting it next Saturday". -- Finished 12/14/03 -- Mermaid (Dimensions) WIP: Angel of Autumn, Calif Sampler, Holiday Snowglobe, Guide the Hands (2d one) Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html |
#27
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On 1/15/04 4:14 PM, in article ,
"Dianne Lewandowski" wrote: Dianne Once again we are on different sides of the highway. Cheryl Isaak wrote: To my comment:Yes, as a member of society I DO have a direct concern for the education of children in my community. Cheryl opined: I don't happen to agree with you, I don't get into the "it takes a village" thing which takes away parental responsibility and gives it to group that has agendas that I don't agree with. BUT since you are so concerned run for school board, join the PTA or other wise get involved! Don't just complain, do something. Offer free piano lessons at the school or give a concert. I don't know of literacy program that has enough help. the "village" approach: And you think parents with children IN school don't have agendas that are self-serving? Yes, but I can say NO, I don't want my child to attend that program or can pull him/her out of class if the discussion is something I don't agree with. The role of public education is to provide the basics - reading, writing, math, civics, history, science. Not to promote Scientology, Creationism or fringe topics. And certainly not moral values. It is my responsibility to educate my children on religious and moral issues - I don't want some one else to do that or taking away my right to do so. And certain issues don't belong in school. To answer your last statement: If you lived here, and lived in my shoes, you'd understand why that's not possible. Anything is possible. If it is an issue you are concerned enough about to take action. I have never been a person to just "complain". I have ALWAYS been very active - including school boards and a major landscape restructuring for an entire town. Loads of volunteer time. Until we came here. So get involved again! What exits with in a reasonable distance? Remember, school starts at A. The soonest the buses can leave is 10 minutes later. Then the drive down and factor in lunch time and the drive back. And time to return to classrooms and getting back on the bus to go home at B. And a fudge factor for traffic... How much of the day is left to see anything? Taking children out of the classroom to visit Lambeau Field isn't a field trip of any educational importance. So, if the district is so poor they can't afford something of cultural or educational merit, they should sit in a classroom and listen to a concert, opera, read books on art . . . whatever. Ok - since you aren't "sports minded" how about the food services, the power plant, all the behind the scenes management. Now THAT impresses me and I feel is an important engagement for students. If a district can't afford a trip to a museum, then this is the next best thing. You'll get no argument from me. I'd bet they see the same kind of things at Lambeau Field - doesn't it also hold concerts, have a grounds crew that has to maintain the surface, a power plant.... I'd bet they just don't kiss the hallowed ground. Then I said: Children, especially children who come from poor, less-culturally advanced areas, need to see museums, symphonies (I think one of the high school clubs DOES go to see a symphony or theatre), etc. etc. If you don't live in poor rural or ghetto areas, then you may not understand what I'm trying to say. To which Cheryl retorted: BULL PUCKY - "culture" is as far away as the internet or the library. You're dreaming. You don't get it. Nor do you understand what I'm trying to say. No - read what I said further down - I don't think operas, plays or art museums are appropriate for trips for students under the age of 15 or 16. Some emotional maturity is needed. There is a better way to do it for the younger students. And what are the art and music teachers covering? Even my little back woods town teacher showed slides covering art history. Music was more than just singing - beat, reading music.... But if a trip to Lambeau Field sparks something else - an interest in grounds keeping even, then it serves multiple functions. Think outside the box. Oh, an opera or master painting won't inspire anyone, but a trip to Lambeau Field might inspire grounds keeping? I don't mind outside of the box thinking, but rationalization for an agenda that doesn't include real culture??? No, I said, a child won't see past the pretty picture, the nude lady or the strange language. And a slide show from a visiting lecturer is more likely do some good than trip to a museum. After all, you are looking for appreciation not confusion and distaste. And the trip to Lambeau Field might spark an interest in engineering or business. Also worthy things. And sport is part of the broad spectrum of culture; you just consider it beneath you. I abhor opera, I'd rather listen to some of today's pop music (the acoustic stuff, no guitar rock for me). I don't like Jason Pollock, do like some of the Impressionists in a vague way, just generally prefer works from the Italian Renaissance. I'd rather go to a hockey game than a classical concert; I don't feel like having a liberal snob look down their nose at my lack of diamonds and designer labels or worse, my political beliefs. If I want to listen to classical, I'll pull out my CDs. Dear Dianne, lets just agree to disagree on this. I don't know all the ins and outs of your town any more than you do mine. I suspect they are more alike than you'd ever want to admit. I want what is right and proper for my children and for all children, an education of the absolute basics, reading, writing, math, history, civics, science and general art and music. The parents have responsibilities here too. And interesting educational opportunities can take the strangest forms. Cheryl Cheryl |
#28
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What a great bunch of ideas!
The local colleges tend to be "technical" or "teacher" colleges. But I'll see what's around. As long its practical and appropriate. I wish there was the Capitol Center for the Arts was still affordable; at $8 a student it isn't. Cheryl |
#29
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Cheryl Isaak wrote:
Yes, but I can say NO, I don't want my child to attend that program or can pull him/her out of class if the discussion is something I don't agree with. The role of public education is to provide the basics - reading, writing, math, civics, history, science. Not to promote Scientology, Creationism or fringe topics. And certainly not moral values. It is my responsibility to educate my children on religious and moral issues - I don't want some one else to do that or taking away my right to do so. And certain issues don't belong in school. And you think visits to a football field are a necessary part of education? Where did the conversation on morals and religion enter my discussion? I certainly never brought it up. I agree with you in your above statements. But culture shouldn't be absent from school . . . it is a part of our "humanities". I'm not an opera fan. I've tried. But I have enjoyed immensely some "lighter" operas, and many *heavy* arias. If you don't open up a child's ear, you lose him forever. These are things that a child has to be surrounded with from birth. You don't wake up at 16 and decide you like Picasso. So get involved again! You are irritating the heck out of me. I TRIED to get involved. For eight years we BOTH tried valiently. It almost killed us emotionally. This is a small, backward town. We are outsiders. And I think if I hear one more time: "then move" I may just lose it. What you have to do is stop thinking about YOUR situation and understand that not everywhere in the U.S. is the same. I read your entire post. I've answered it above. I disagree with you. Your circumstances are different than mine. While we're at it: If you don't think it takes a village, and if you don't think I should have any input, then maybe you don't want my tax dollars, either. No, I said, a child won't see past the pretty picture, the nude lady or the strange language. And a slide show from a visiting lecturer is more likely do some good than trip to a museum. After all, you are looking for appreciation not confusion and distaste. You have a very narrow view, I'm afraid. And sport is part of the broad spectrum of culture; you just consider it beneath you. No, I don't. But you, obviously, think it should be right up there at the top of the list. I think ALL these things are a part of being human and one does not deserve more attention than another. THAT'S my point. The only diamond I have is my mother's and grandmother's put into one ring. I don't wear designer anything because I refuse to advertise for them. Who in their right mind wants "Gucci" printed all over their evening wear? Liberal? No. Centrist, Yes. Basic education? Absolutely. Including the basics of art, literature, music. A modicum of sports presented in a healthy, team-spirited intent. Dianne |
#30
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In article ,
ekoluvr (Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply ) writes: Of course, ANY Bugs Bunny or Daffy performance that includes "heavy opera" IS imminently enjoyable and quite acceptable to my way of thinking :-)))! Getcher butt out here! At this time of year, with all the rain and dark days, Looney Tunes Musical Masterpieces is a frequent visitor to the VCR! Weeeeeetuwwwwn my wuvvvvv! For a fun experience with heavy opera, get The Anna Russell Album. She hits the highlights of The Ring Cycle in 18 minutes, concluding high pitched, nasal voice, British accent "And here you ahhhh, twennnnty-threee aaaaaaaahhhhhhhhrrrs later, RIGHT BACK WHERE WE STARTED!!!!" Thereupon, you play your serious Ring Cycle CD, and ROFLMAOWTIMEWPIMP because you can't hear the music without thinking of how she skewered it! (I'll have to have Mom try to track down MY version of the Ring, including a bunch of mermaids singing "My beer is Rheingold, the dry beer" and one of the lovesick wailing "Since my baby left me, I found a new place to dwell, it's down the end of Lonely Street, the Heartbreak Hotel", while the guy fashioning the magic ring sings "Take a ring, and add another ring, and add another ring, and now you've got three rings, Ballantyne!". Hey -- it's a German opera, and what's more German than beer?) Oh, Bwunnhiwwwde, you're so wuvwy! Yes, I know it, I cahn't help it! -- Finished 12/14/03 -- Mermaid (Dimensions) WIP: Angel of Autumn, Calif Sampler, Holiday Snowglobe, Guide the Hands (2d one) Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html |
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