Propane regulator question

I'm working with our local propane (and propane accessories guy to get a
100# propane tank for the studio. He has some regulators on hand and has
asked specifically what sort of PSI lampworking uses for the propane end of
the mix. Can someone help me with that? In the books or sites I've seen,
they talk about one-stage and two-stage regulators but they never mention
the PSI needs. He has the two-stage regulators, I believe.

Also, he thought that a flashback arrester was just sort of a gimmick. He
had actually never heard of the term and is going home at lunch to look at
the site where I first saw them to find out what they are. What's
everyone's opinion on this bit of info? Does he not know what he's talking
about, is the terminology just odd or are they a gimmick?

Thx,
Giselle

You should be able to just use a pancake regulator with most torches;
it's a cheap little doohickey and drops the pressure down to about what
you need, which is, depending on your torch, 5-10 PSI. A two-stage
regulator is going to be a very large and not entirely necessary
expense; most people do fine with single-stage regulators at half the
cost. Pancake regulators are a fraction of even that cost.

I'm mildly alarmed that Mr. Propane & Propane Accessories doesn't know
what a flashback arrestor is. :O! All it is, is essentially a backflow
valve that prevents anything (FIRE) from flowing backward into the tank
and causing an explosion.

You might want to check your Yellow Pages for a welding supply shop in
your area. Their torches are very similar and the way you set them up is
virtually identical, so they will probably be many times more helpful.
They'll have the right hoses, regulators, quick-connects, flashback
arrestors, the works.

Fragile Warrior Bees wrote:
I'm working with our local propane (and propane accessories guy to get a
100# propane tank for the studio. He has some regulators on hand and has
asked specifically what sort of PSI lampworking uses for the propane end of
the mix. Can someone help me with that? In the books or sites I've seen,
they talk about one-stage and two-stage regulators but they never mention
the PSI needs. He has the two-stage regulators, I believe.

Also, he thought that a flashback arrester was just sort of a gimmick. He
had actually never heard of the term and is going home at lunch to look at
the site where I first saw them to find out what they are. What's
everyone's opinion on this bit of info? Does he not know what he's talking
about, is the terminology just odd or are they a gimmick?

Thx,
Giselle



--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

"Kalera" wrote in message
...
You should be able to just use a pancake regulator with most torches; it's
a cheap little doohickey and drops the pressure down to about what you
need, which is, depending on your torch, 5-10 PSI. A two-stage regulator
is going to be a very large and not entirely necessary expense; most
people do fine with single-stage regulators at half the cost. Pancake
regulators are a fraction of even that cost.

I'm not entirely sure if I'm buying the regulator or renting it at this
point. We'll have to see.


I'm mildly alarmed that Mr. Propane & Propane Accessories doesn't know
what a flashback arrestor is. :O! All it is, is essentially a backflow
valve that prevents anything (FIRE) from flowing backward into the tank
and causing an explosion.

Yep, he said that can't happen. No propane = no flame. The end. Honest to
God, unless they call it something entirely different here in East
Bubblebutt, Indiana, he did not know what I was talking about. I gave him
the backwash scenerio and he said he did not think it could possibly occur.
Their welding torches do not use it.


You might want to check your Yellow Pages for a welding supply shop in
your area. Their torches are very similar and the way you set them up is
virtually identical, so they will probably be many times more helpful.
They'll have the right hoses, regulators, quick-connects, flashback
arrestors, the works.

Nearest welding place is like 50 miles away. I was hoping to find something
closer to home but I'll keep it in mind in case I need to go elsewhere.

Thx,
Giselle

Pancake regulators don't typically offer enough pressure to allow a
flashback arrestor to work. The good news is that for a surface mix
torch, an arrestor really isn't required.

Tink Martin - Art Glass
Check here for available work:
http://blackswampglassworks.com/latest.htm

Very interesting! I didn't know that the functionality of the arrestor
is tied to the pressure. I probably run my regulator far too low for the
arrestor to be useful, then.

I did know that flashback arrestors aren't really necessary on
surface-mix torches because they don't flashback, but it's kind of a
nice notion in case of the also incredibly unlikely hose rupture.

Tinkster wrote:
Pancake regulators don't typically offer enough pressure to allow a
flashback arrestor to work. The good news is that for a surface mix
torch, an arrestor really isn't required.

Tink Martin - Art Glass
Check here for available work:
http://blackswampglassworks.com/latest.htm

--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

Fragile Warrior Bees wrote:
"Kalera" wrote in message
...

You should be able to just use a pancake regulator with most torches; it's
a cheap little doohickey and drops the pressure down to about what you
need, which is, depending on your torch, 5-10 PSI. A two-stage regulator
is going to be a very large and not entirely necessary expense; most
people do fine with single-stage regulators at half the cost. Pancake
regulators are a fraction of even that cost.


I'm not entirely sure if I'm buying the regulator or renting it at this
point. We'll have to see.


I'm mildly alarmed that Mr. Propane & Propane Accessories doesn't know
what a flashback arrestor is. :O! All it is, is essentially a backflow
valve that prevents anything (FIRE) from flowing backward into the tank
and causing an explosion.


Yep, he said that can't happen. No propane = no flame. The end. Honest to
God, unless they call it something entirely different here in East
Bubblebutt, Indiana, he did not know what I was talking about. I gave him
the backwash scenerio and he said he did not think it could possibly occur.
Their welding torches do not use it.

But there would, indeed, be propane. It is the propane that would be on
fire!

You might want to check your Yellow Pages for a welding supply shop in
your area. Their torches are very similar and the way you set them up is
virtually identical, so they will probably be many times more helpful.
They'll have the right hoses, regulators, quick-connects, flashback
arrestors, the works.


Nearest welding place is like 50 miles away. I was hoping to find something
closer to home but I'll keep it in mind in case I need to go elsewhere.

Thx,
Giselle



--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

"Kalera" wrote in message
...

Yep, he said that can't happen. No propane = no flame. The end. Honest
to God, unless they call it something entirely different here in East
Bubblebutt, Indiana, he did not know what I was talking about. I gave
him the backwash scenerio and he said he did not think it could possibly
occur. Their welding torches do not use it.

But there would, indeed, be propane. It is the propane that would be on
fire!

No, he meant propane ON. Even if turned off in incorrect order, he said no,
couldn't happen. shrug

Giselle (we'll see. If I make the news, you'll know he was wrong. Sue him
for me, 'kay?)

Flashback can happen when you're actually using a torch, not when the
tank valve is closed. It's not a likely occurrence, made more or less
nonexistent by using a surface-mix torch. I'm just baffled and a bit
appalled that he denies that it occurs at all and has never even heard
of flashback arrestors, ever, despite the fact that A: Flashback is a
well-known phenomenon, and B: the arrestors are standard equipment
available at every welding and glass supply store. I personally know
boro workers using premix torches that have had non-catastrophic flashbacks.

http://www.toolboxtopics.com/Gen%20I...0Flashback.htm
http://info.anu.edu.au/hr/OHS/Hazard..._Arrestors.asp
http://www.murexwelding.co.uk/mrxcont/gas/mrxgcse.htm
http://www.iigas.com/fba.htm
http://www.butbro.co.uk/flashback.htm

Obviously, since you're using a surface-mix torch, it's not really an
issue for you. However, his ignorance on this matter tends to make me
worry about the validity of his knowledge in other areas... for example,
renting you a regulator. They're not *that* expensive! A pancake
regulator can be had for about $12! It may benefit you to run stuff by
us here, or a place like ISGB.org, Artglassforum.com, or
Lampworketc.com, populated by glass techie types, before you go by what
Mr. Propane & Propane Accessories tells you.


Fragile Warrior Bees wrote:
"Kalera" wrote in message
...


Yep, he said that can't happen. No propane = no flame. The end. Honest
to God, unless they call it something entirely different here in East
Bubblebutt, Indiana, he did not know what I was talking about. I gave
him the backwash scenerio and he said he did not think it could possibly
occur. Their welding torches do not use it.

But there would, indeed, be propane. It is the propane that would be on
fire!


No, he meant propane ON. Even if turned off in incorrect order, he said no,
couldn't happen. shrug

Giselle (we'll see. If I make the news, you'll know he was wrong. Sue him
for me, 'kay?)



--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

Giselle, the pressure you need is determined in large part by the
torch you have. What torch will you be using?

Also, the propane tank will be outside the studio, yes?

On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 09:22:17 -0500, "Fragile Warrior Bees"
wrote:

I'm working with our local propane (and propane accessories guy to get a
100# propane tank for the studio. He has some regulators on hand and has
asked specifically what sort of PSI lampworking uses for the propane end of
the mix. Can someone help me with that? In the books or sites I've seen,
they talk about one-stage and two-stage regulators but they never mention
the PSI needs. He has the two-stage regulators, I believe.

Also, he thought that a flashback arrester was just sort of a gimmick. He
had actually never heard of the term and is going home at lunch to look at
the site where I first saw them to find out what they are. What's
everyone's opinion on this bit of info? Does he not know what he's talking
about, is the terminology just odd or are they a gimmick?

Thx,
Giselle



Tink Martin - Art Glass
Check here for available work:
http://blackswampglassworks.com/latest.htm

"Tinkster" wrote in message
...
Giselle, the pressure you need is determined in large part by the
torch you have. What torch will you be using?

A Nortel Minor.


Also, the propane tank will be outside the studio, yes?

We're deciding. Since we operate the house on propane, there's a 300# tank
between the house and the studio location. The "studio" will be a room
sectioned off in a large, empty metal structure. The tank can be place
anywhere at this point but are you asking if it will it be far away from
open flame? Far enough. I'm chicken. But I am getting used to living
around tanks of propane that can obliterate all life in a 1/2 mile area.