Doubling of the Chinese Button Knot

Cedro wrote, "I am having no success what so even in getting past a
mental barrier of which prevents me from doubling either the
Boatswain's Whistle Knot or the Chinese Button Knot. . . . direct me
to an illustration ... ".

Does http://www.knottingartist.com/button-diag.html help?

Brian.

The URL Brian mentioned (www.knottingartist.com) is no longer owned by me,
therefore I have no way of updating the information on it. The diagram
source has a new URL, it is http://www.ropeworks.biz/reader/boatswai.pdf.
When I was asked to sell the domain name I was not advised that the content
is part of the deal. Sigh... BTW, the Chinese button knot is the same as
boat swain's whistle knot.

Yvonne Chang

"Brian G." wrote in message
oups.com...
Cedro wrote, "I am having no success what so even in getting past a
mental barrier of which prevents me from doubling either the
Boatswain's Whistle Knot or the Chinese Button Knot. . . . direct me
to an illustration ... ".

Does http://www.knottingartist.com/button-diag.html help?

Brian.

Cedro,

"...taken each working end around the loop leg on the opposite
side before passing it down through the center" is the correct technique.

Adobe Reader is free, can be downloaded by going to the adobe website,
www.adobe.com.

Yvonne

"Cedro Wooly" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:34:17 -0800, "Yvonne Chang"
wrote:

The URL Brian mentioned (www.knottingartist.com) is no longer owned by
me,
therefore I have no way of updating the information on it. The diagram
source has a new URL, it is http://www.ropeworks.biz/reader/boatswai.pdf.
When I was asked to sell the domain name I was not advised that the
content
is part of the deal. Sigh... BTW, the Chinese button knot is the same as
boat swain's whistle knot.

I have been mistaken then. I had begun each knot with a carrick bend
with a loop in the standing line. In tying the boatswains whistle knot
I have then taken each working end around the loop leg on the opposite
side before passing it down through the center. In tying the Chinese
button knot I had not taken the working ends around the loop leg but
rather simply passed each end down through the center from opposite
sides.

If you can visualize what I have described, which is the correct
method of tying the knot?

I hope to be able to view the page you have referenced but at the
present time I have been unable to install the Adobe pdf reader on my
computer (it keeps asking me for a disc that I never had ;-(

Thank you very much for your response, Yvonne.


Yvonne Chang

Cedro,

I think part of the confusion between the "Chinese Button Knot" and the
"Bosun's Whistle Knot" (ABOK #787) starts with "The Ashley Book of
Knots" (ABOK). It is basically the usual confusion with knot names.

As you may know, Lydia Chen wrote books on Chinese Knotting. Her first
volume was translated into English and published in 1982. She is from
Taiwan and her research and work in the history and art of Chinese
knotting has made her a definitive authority.

In her first volume, Ms. Chen shows the "Button Knot" and it is
identical with the "Bosun's Whistle Knot". Hence, Ms. Chen helped
establish that the name "Chinese Button Knot" and the name "Bosun's
Whistle Knot" refer to the same knot. On the other hand, Ashley says,
in ABOK #602, "... so far as I know, [Bosun's Whistle Knot] has not
been utilized by the Chinese". For us, I think, Ms. Chen's definition
of the "Chinese Button Knot" is the accepted one.

On the other hand, Ashley says that the knot ABOK #600 (your Chinese
Button Knot) is the "common Chinese Button Knot". ABOK #600 is ABOK
#788A and it is not the "Bosun's Whistle Knot". I think this is the
cause of some confusion when one talks about which final tuck is the
"Chinese Button Knot". I agree with Yvonne: the "Bosun's Whistle Knot"
is the "Chinese Button Knot". However, I suspect that ABOK #600, the
knot Ashley calls the "common Chinese Button Knot", is also, and has
been used as, a button knot.

Ashley's #601 shows his "common Chinese Button Knot" doubled. Ashley's
#788B shows the "Bosun's Whistle Knot" / "Chinese Button Knot" doubled.

I hope you have access to Ashley's Book of Knots and that I have not
added to confusion!!! - Brian.