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#71
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Hi Hanne,
Language and grammar is so interesting and fun :-) I am always amazed at how one language (English) can vary so greatly within and between countries. When DH and I first were together we used to have arguments until we discovered we were arguing about the same point of view; it was just that my vocabulary was USA and his was NZ If you ever do happen to spend some time 'south' give a yell, I can tell you all the bestest places to live Shona in NZ "Hanne Gottliebsen" wrote in message ... It's me again (yes I did wrongly write eg. earlier). Let me quote from Fowler (IME preferred by K academics + the one retired English teacher who proofread my PhD thesis): About i.e. quote on It is naturally preceded by a stop; it should not be followed by a comma unless the sense requires one, to introduce a parenthesis for instance. [italics on] He attacked reactionaries, i.e. those whose opinions differed from his own[italic of], but [italics on] He attacked reationaries, i.e., it would seem, those whose opinions etc. quote of For scientific papers (all I see are computer science, mathematics and a few medical ones) usually British scientists do not put the comma, US ones do. I don't have enough experience of Southern Hemisphere English of any kind to comment :-) Maybe I need to spend a couple of years somewhere a lot further South next... Also, I don't think I ever use i.e. (but sometimes e.g.) in non-scientific writing. And certainly one sometimes see papers with _way_ too many i.e.s in them. Like I think I said early on: a Columbian colleague of mine in the US and I had to just declare a truce on the issue. When rewieving eachothers papers, I did not take out his commas after i.e. and he did not my "missing" ones. We never did co-author - tha tmight have caused some discussion :-) Hanne -who spent 30 min last night going through book boxes trying to find her copy of Fowler. Shona in NZ wrote: I agree with you Jack that both can replaced easily with English word ('for example' and 'that is') unfortunately i.e. and e.g. run rife in scientific writing due to limits on publication space; it takes up far less page space to put i.e. or e.g. :-S On your other point, my formal scientific training took place here in NZ and the comma after the period is one of those rules that got fairly well imprinted. In fact there are lecturers out there that have taken the comma after e.g. and i.e. to the height of being grammatical "pet peeve" and will mark off extra if it is omitted (ask me how I know :-)). Perhaps it is a scientific thing rather than a more mainstream thing? Shona finding the i.e./e.g. thread very interesting in NZ "bogus address" wrote in message ... Near as I know there should always be a comma after e.g. (and i.e. for that matter) no matter what the english language. I was taught USA english and now use New Zealand/Australian (~British) english. The way I do it: "e.g." and "i.e." MUST have the full stops (they're abbreviations), and because a comma following a full stop looks silly you NEVER put one after either. But both are Latin expressions for things you can equally well say in English so it's better not to use them in the first place. Most of my education was in New Zealand and I think this approach is the usual one there. You haven't forgotten your American usages as much as you think you have. Alluding to another OT thread: grew up in New Zealand, spent more than half my life in Scotland, born in a country I hardly remember despite my accent mostly being from there. My answer to "where are you from?" is "is it compulsory to be from anywhere in particular?" ======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce ======== Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data & recipes, Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music. |
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#72
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Hi Marissa,
I just sent a PDF copy to you. Let me know if you don't get it and I will try again. S in NZ "Dr. Quilter" wrote in message ... could you? no hurry, but I'd love to have a copy in my library for when the doubts hit... Shona in NZ wrote: |
#73
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Hi Shona,
Language and grammar is so interesting and fun :-) I am always amazed at how one language (English) can vary so greatly within and between countries. When DH and I first were together we used to have arguments until we discovered we were arguing about the same point of view; it was just that my vocabulary was USA and his was NZ Oh oh, I can see how this could easily happen. Danish and Swedish are pretty similar, and once in High School we were reading this Swedish text (Danish high school students have to read other nordic literature too). Someone was translating and said "the plums were dropping onto the water and floated the river". However, the Swedish word for flowers is the same as the Danish word for plums. Very romantic. Another time I was cooking with a Norwegian friend of mine, I was chopping onion and she turned around and said (in Norwegian) "are you laughing?" I was like "what? no, I'm crying my eyes out" We had to revert to English to clear the issue. One of the Norwegian words for crying is the same as a Danish word for laughter. How on earth these languages can be some close and then have issues like that I'll never understand. But yes, it is kind of fun. If you ever do happen to spend some time 'south' give a yell, I can tell you all the bestest places to live Will do, will do! Hanne Shona in NZ "Hanne Gottliebsen" wrote in message ... It's me again (yes I did wrongly write eg. earlier). Let me quote from Fowler (IME preferred by K academics + the one retired English teacher who proofread my PhD thesis): About i.e. quote on It is naturally preceded by a stop; it should not be followed by a comma unless the sense requires one, to introduce a parenthesis for instance. [italics on] He attacked reactionaries, i.e. those whose opinions differed from his own[italic of], but [italics on] He attacked reationaries, i.e., it would seem, those whose opinions etc. quote of For scientific papers (all I see are computer science, mathematics and a few medical ones) usually British scientists do not put the comma, US ones do. I don't have enough experience of Southern Hemisphere English of any kind to comment :-) Maybe I need to spend a couple of years somewhere a lot further South next... Also, I don't think I ever use i.e. (but sometimes e.g.) in non-scientific writing. And certainly one sometimes see papers with _way_ too many i.e.s in them. Like I think I said early on: a Columbian colleague of mine in the US and I had to just declare a truce on the issue. When rewieving eachothers papers, I did not take out his commas after i.e. and he did not my "missing" ones. We never did co-author - tha tmight have caused some discussion :-) Hanne -who spent 30 min last night going through book boxes trying to find her copy of Fowler. Shona in NZ wrote: I agree with you Jack that both can replaced easily with English word ('for example' and 'that is') unfortunately i.e. and e.g. run rife in scientific writing due to limits on publication space; it takes up far less page space to put i.e. or e.g. :-S On your other point, my formal scientific training took place here in NZ and the comma after the period is one of those rules that got fairly well imprinted. In fact there are lecturers out there that have taken the comma after e.g. and i.e. to the height of being grammatical "pet peeve" and will mark off extra if it is omitted (ask me how I know :-)). Perhaps it is a scientific thing rather than a more mainstream thing? Shona finding the i.e./e.g. thread very interesting in NZ "bogus address" wrote in message ... Near as I know there should always be a comma after e.g. (and i.e. for that matter) no matter what the english language. I was taught USA english and now use New Zealand/Australian (~British) english. The way I do it: "e.g." and "i.e." MUST have the full stops (they're abbreviations), and because a comma following a full stop looks silly you NEVER put one after either. But both are Latin expressions for things you can equally well say in English so it's better not to use them in the first place. Most of my education was in New Zealand and I think this approach is the usual one there. You haven't forgotten your American usages as much as you think you have. Alluding to another OT thread: grew up in New Zealand, spent more than half my life in Scotland, born in a country I hardly remember despite my accent mostly being from there. My answer to "where are you from?" is "is it compulsory to be from anywhere in particular?" ======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce ======== Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data & recipes, Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music. |
#74
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got it, thanks! )
Shona in NZ wrote: Hi Marissa, I just sent a PDF copy to you. Let me know if you don't get it and I will try again. S in NZ "Dr. Quilter" wrote in message ... could you? no hurry, but I'd love to have a copy in my library for when the doubts hit... Shona in NZ wrote: -- Dr. Quilter Ambassador of Extraordinary Aliens http://community.webshots.com/user/mvignali (take the dog out before replying) |
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