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#11
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Diane Hare wrote:
I believe "dressing" will make a world of difference on more fragile fabrics. Anyway, there are things we can get away with on cross-stitch that wont'd work with lush wools or metal-thread embroideries. Actually, hoops don't destroy stitches previously made - even wool ones. Nor Brazilian ones, nor heavily padded Mountmellick ones. However, I wouldn't squish a hoop down on gold work. :-) I wasn't aware of full-dressing until this year. Half-dressing is wrapping the inside of a plain (not lip'd) hoop with cotton floss or yarn, as a cushion and to avoid direction contact with metal or potential for wood splinters. Actually, nice wooden hoops - even cheap ones for that matter - rarely if ever splinter. But they can stain. Normally, a hoop is wound with cotton twill. Strips of muslin do just as well, are cheap and easy to acquire. Polyester twill tape is too chunky, unwieldy, and attracks dirt like a magnet. It's interesting to hear about wrapping with yarn. That would take forever. :-) It would also be prone to moving around a lot, I would think? I've crocheted enough rings to know how slippery and tedious it is to fill up a ring. In the U.S., the common method is to wrap the inner hoop. In other countries, they wrap the outer hoop. I wrap both on my tambour hoop, the inner on the hand hoops. But I've wrapped both on those as well. What wrapping does, essentially, is give you a tight fit - as well as some protection from whatever material the hoop is made. Metal can rust, wood can stain. Another type of "dressing" is usually a large cloth that protects areas of the embroidery that isn't being worked on. It has a round opening smaller than the hoop size. You can also just use strips of muslin for this purpose, but Stefania's pretty cloth is a nice way of doing this. How fussy you are about your embroidery depends upon the final use, whether or not it can be washed. One would take greater pains with silk or metal than you would with ordinary cottons or color-fast wools. The extra piece not only cushions the fabric but also protects the stressed edge from direct abrasion and incidental soiling. The only other thing I can add to this discussion is: DO NOT pull on fabric once the upper hoop has been tightened down. This will distort finer fabrics. Coarser ones can take the abuse - most times. But you will permanently ruin finer fabrics by doing this. If you don't have your embroidery lined up properly, unfasten the upper hoop and start over. The disadvantages of a hoop are all the fussing required and the constant moving around - particularly with the smaller hoops. Large ones are difficult to manage unless they're on some sort of stand. With a frame, you can set up your cloth and be done with it. But there are some stitches that don't lend themselves to working in a frame, or at the least you will have to slacken the fabric for stitches using the sewing method (chain, stem, bullions, fishbone as examples). Dianne |
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#12
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Dianne Lewandowski wrote:
Diane Hare wrote: there are things we can get away with on cross-stitch that wont'd work with lush wools or metal-thread embroideries. Actually, hoops don't destroy stitches previously made - even wool ones. Nor Brazilian ones, nor heavily padded Mountmellick ones. However, I wouldn't squish a hoop down on gold work. :-) It's not that the stitches would be destroyed, it's that the hoop couldn't grip evenly over the lumps. I wasn't aware of full-dressing until this year. Half-dressing is wrapping the inside of a plain (not lip'd) hoop with cotton floss or yarn, as a cushion and to avoid direction contact with metal or potential for wood splinters. Actually, nice wooden hoops - even cheap ones for that matter - rarely if ever splinter. But they can stain. $1 hoops have splinters as often as cheap chopsticks. They may be the poorest possible choice, but they're sometimes all a person has (been there, glad to have had what I'd had rather than nothing at all). Normally, a hoop is wound with cotton twill. Strips of muslin do just as well, are cheap and easy to acquire. Polyester twill tape is too chunky, unwieldy, and attracks dirt like a magnet. It's interesting to hear about wrapping with yarn. That would take forever. :-) It would also be prone to moving around a lot, I would think? I've crocheted enough rings to know how slippery and tedious it is to fill up a ring. Wrapping with yarn doesn't take any longer than wrapping with 1/4-inch twill tape. Either is less intensive than the tedium of wrapping a lampshade frame. When I'd cited yarn, I'd in mind cotton rug yarn. In the U.S., the common method is to wrap the inner hoop. In other countries, they wrap the outer hoop. I wrap both on my tambour hoop, the inner on the hand hoops. But I've wrapped both on those as well. What wrapping does, essentially, is give you a tight fit - as well as some protection from whatever material the hoop is made. Metal can rust, wood can stain. Another type of "dressing" is usually a large cloth that protects areas of the embroidery that isn't being worked on. It has a round opening smaller than the hoop size. You can also just use strips of muslin for this purpose, but Stefania's pretty cloth is a nice way of doing this. How fussy you are about your embroidery depends upon the final use, whether or not it can be washed. One would take greater pains with silk or metal than you would with ordinary cottons or color-fast wools. It can also depend on how long the project will take and in what conditions. Will it be tossed into a bag and toted about? Will it be done in a week or might it be a year of once/week stitching in diverse locations and conditions? The extra piece not only cushions the fabric but also protects the stressed edge from direct abrasion and incidental soiling. The only other thing I can add to this discussion is: DO NOT pull on fabric once the upper hoop has been tightened down. This will distort finer fabrics. Coarser ones can take the abuse - most times. But you will permanently ruin finer fabrics by doing this. If you don't have your embroidery lined up properly, unfasten the upper hoop and start over. The disadvantages of a hoop are all the fussing required and the constant moving around - particularly with the smaller hoops. Large ones are difficult to manage unless they're on some sort of stand. With a frame, you can set up your cloth and be done with it. But there are some stitches that don't lend themselves to working in a frame, or at the least you will have to slacken the fabric for stitches using the sewing method (chain, stem, bullions, fishbone as examples). Or do the in-hand stitches last, after removal from whichever sort of frame. Diane Hare |
#13
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I'm enjoying this discussion.
Diane Hare wrote: It's not that the stitches would be destroyed, it's that the hoop couldn't grip evenly over the lumps. I haven't noticed that as a problem. A screwdriver is the trick. Paint the handle purple with a red dot. Keep it with your sewing supplies. :-) $1 hoops have splinters as often as cheap chopsticks. They may be the poorest possible choice, but they're sometimes all a person has (been there, glad to have had what I'd had rather than nothing at all). Gee, I've used those cheap "made in China" hoops and haven't noticed any splinters. Maybe that's because I'm in such a habit of wrapping (though not always), I haven't come across the problem. My problem with the cheap hoops are that the hinges for the screw snap off, or that the screw strips and won't tighten sufficiently. Even the German ones don't always come shipped to me in pristine condition. Sometimes a layer hasn't quite been hit well enough with the glue. I've been trying to find a source for the wider ones - which do seem to make a more snug fit. Wrapping with yarn doesn't take any longer than wrapping with 1/4-inch twill tape. Either is less intensive than the tedium of wrapping a lampshade frame. When I'd cited yarn, I'd in mind cotton rug yarn. Actually, twill tape that I've used is at least a half inch. :-) But it's so difficult to find the 100% cotton these days, so I use one-inch strips of muslin. Goes fast. I have never, ever seen a yarn-wrapped hoop. But then, I live in a near cloistered situation. In my life, I haven't known anyone else (in person) who embroiders. Yes, I've wrapped lampshades. Takes forever! It can also depend on how long the project will take and in what conditions. Will it be tossed into a bag and toted about? Will it be done in a week or might it be a year of once/week stitching in diverse locations and conditions? I wonder if I should share my story of the drawn thread curtain that sat, tightly clamped in a tambour hoop, for over a year? It was filthy. It wasn't finished. I've never experienced this type of problem, but I wasn't going to lose this curtain and the work I had done to date. It's as good as new, already to be fitted back in the hoop and begun again. Or, the story of the silk thread embroidery that was clamped tight (screwdriver tight) for months. Padded needlepainting. It, too, is as good as new. I don't recommend this treatment. My life has been difficult for some time, and my projects got neglected. Lots of starts and stops on different things trying to cope. But I can say with impunity that we worry too much about this stuff. Embroidery can take a LOT of hard treatment and bounce back good as new. Or do the in-hand stitches last, after removal from whichever sort of frame. That is an option of which I am currently undertaking. But not last - rather as a set up for drawn fabric. :-) This piece has been in and out of a hoop numerous times. Thanks for the lively discussion on an interesting topic. Dianne |
#14
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I'd been embroiderying for 2.5 decades before I ever had a hoop that
didn't have spring tension . . . metal with a cork strip. The cork had lost its oomph and wrapping gave a tighter fit. I've no guess how long my mom'd had it before she'd shared it with me. After checking our storage unit last evening and I came home with my envelopes of Coats & Clarks floss . . . Way back when I'd been so happy to have finally completed my collection, and then I'd seen a *real* LNS with DMC & evenweave fabrics (I'd been embroidering on the backs of pre-stamped 100% linen stuffs) and was overwhelmed. I got myself a satin-finished wooden hoop then, with a flat spring. I still don't have a tambour hoop that's both nice _and_ tightens with a screw/bolt. There was also a 2-yard length of doodle fabric with a needle locked in one corner. I'm reminded to never, ever, leave the needle in the fabric. I'm figuring how to use a piece of acid-free card-stock and a scrap of fabric to make a needle stash to be held to the corner of the fabric with a couple of stitches, because it is convenient to stall a needle with an incomplete project. There's already keep a combination folding pliers/screwdriver/etc under a flap in my large needlework bag. I don't need to worry about Hubby snagging it. He has his stuff in the computer jungle area and we both have more in a kitchen drawer. I grin as I consider the _need_ to make a case for the all-in-one-tool to match the scissors case, needle case, eyeglass case, etc. Yes, I am also enjoying the discussions. They're a good alternative to more than an hour's stitching on 48-count and to vegging out with DVD's. Diane Hare Dianne Lewandowski wrote: I'm enjoying this discussion. Diane Hare wrote: It's not that the stitches would be destroyed, it's that the hoop couldn't grip evenly over the lumps. I haven't noticed that as a problem. A screwdriver is the trick. Paint the handle purple with a red dot. Keep it with your sewing supplies. :-) $1 hoops have splinters as often as cheap chopsticks. They may be the poorest possible choice, but they're sometimes all a person has (been there, glad to have had what I'd had rather than nothing at all). Gee, I've used those cheap "made in China" hoops and haven't noticed any splinters. Maybe that's because I'm in such a habit of wrapping (though not always), I haven't come across the problem. My problem with the cheap hoops are that the hinges for the screw snap off, or that the screw strips and won't tighten sufficiently. |
#15
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GREAT SUGGESTION I had not thought of "dressing the fabric" when I get
to the project I want to do which calls for satin jean fabric. Perhaps I can forgo the expense of a square/slate frame for now, and the stand, since I did spend money recently on a seat frame with a deep German 10 inch hoop. BTW, I got his on ebay and really like it. It has an "articulated" upright post - meaning the post is in two pieces and is held together with a screw. You can adjust the stand to put the hoop at the height and angle you want it. I think this is more versitale than the type of fanny frame available from England (available from "Royal School of Needlework" on their website. Early in the week I saw that the couple who make the stand w/german hoop which I bought on ebay have a listing with 3 more just like mine available. The seller's name is "Wandaken" if anyone wants to look it up on ebay. It's listed at $33, but this is about 1/2 the cost of the English-made seat frame. The hoop is a top-quality German-made 1" deep and 10" around hoop with a brass screw - I saw the same one for $16 on a website of needlework products. If I want to purchase a different sized hoop it would be a simple thing to drill a small, inset, screw hole into the inner hoop and use this frame of other projects as well. I wanted a square frame primarily because I d taking the fabric out each night and then fussing with getting it in tight again - but I have gathered that it's not such a big deal to leave your project in the hoop overnight. If I decided to put a project aside for awhile I will take it out - but in that case I am probably using the hoop for whatever I switched to... :-) I pulled out my sewing machine and will make a "dress for my hoop this weekend. Dianne pointed me to the instructions for doing so on the EmbroideryNow site when I posted on Dianne's discussion board last week (thanks for pointing me to this list Dianne!) I looked for cotton twill tape to wrap the inside of my hoop at Hancocks and only found polyester, so I will have to use muslin instead (hadn't thought of that until I read this thread.) I confess that I pull on my fabric to get it tight all the time - but I am using heavy linen for crewel embroidery - so that's not such a big deal in my case. Speaking of new projects - I got the book with Jacobean Iron-On Transfers today. I have been working kits to learn stitches and get the feel for crewel embroidery - so using iron-on transfers will be the next big step in my personal development in this art. I think the motifs in the Jacobean Iron-On Transfers book are WONDERFUL but I do not care for the colors in the original piece. I have gathered from some reading I have done in the archives that many do not like Jacobean due to the predominate grey and brown colors. I read somewhere that the pieces we have from centuries ago may actually be faded or the dyes have not held up... Regardless, there is no reason why I cannot do a modern color scheme with these Jacobean motifs. I have Jane Rainbow's "A Beginner's Guide to Crewel Embroidery" - which is very inspirational in this regard. I understand Sue Hawkins & Judy Jeroy's books on crewel are also inspirational in regards to choosing colors for jacobean-style crewel, but I don't have either book yet. (Boo Hoo) I think rather than getting a stand and square frame right now I will concentrate on building my thread and fabric collections (such fun) and of course my book collection. :-) THANKS TO ALL SEWING SUSAN Minnesota |
#16
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GREAT SUGGESTION I had not thought of "dressing the fabric" when I get
to the project I want to do which calls for satin jean fabric. Perhaps I can forgo the expense of a square/slate frame for now, and the stand, since I did spend money recently on a seat frame with a deep German 10 inch hoop. BTW, I got his on ebay and really like it. It has an "articulated" upright post - meaning the post is in two pieces and is held together with a screw. You can adjust the stand to put the hoop at the height and angle you want it. I think this is more versitale than the type of fanny frame available from England (available from "Royal School of Needlework" on their website. Early in the week I saw that the couple who make the stand w/german hoop which I bought on ebay have a listing with 3 more just like mine available. The seller's name is "Wandaken" if anyone wants to look it up on ebay. It's listed at $33, but this is about 1/2 the cost of the English-made seat frame. The hoop is a top-quality German-made 1" deep and 10" around hoop with a brass screw - I saw the same one for $16 on a website of needlework products. If I want to purchase a different sized hoop it would be a simple thing to drill a small, inset, screw hole into the inner hoop and use this frame of other projects as well. I wanted a square frame primarily because I d taking the fabric out each night and then fussing with getting it in tight again - but I have gathered that it's not such a big deal to leave your project in the hoop overnight. If I decided to put a project aside for awhile I will take it out - but in that case I am probably using the hoop for whatever I switched to... :-) I pulled out my sewing machine and will make a "dress for my hoop this weekend. Dianne pointed me to the instructions for doing so on the EmbroideryNow site when I posted on Dianne's discussion board last week (thanks for pointing me to this list Dianne!) I looked for cotton twill tape to wrap the inside of my hoop at Hancocks and only found polyester, so I will have to use muslin instead (hadn't thought of that until I read this thread.) I confess that I pull on my fabric to get it tight all the time - but I am using heavy linen for crewel embroidery - so that's not such a big deal in my case. Speaking of new projects - I got the book with Jacobean Iron-On Transfers today. I have been working kits to learn stitches and get the feel for crewel embroidery - so using iron-on transfers will be the next big step in my personal development in this art. I think the motifs in the Jacobean Iron-On Transfers book are WONDERFUL but I do not care for the colors in the original piece. I have gathered from some reading I have done in the archives that many do not like Jacobean due to the predominate grey and brown colors. I read somewhere that the pieces we have from centuries ago may actually be faded or the dyes have not held up... Regardless, there is no reason why I cannot do a modern color scheme with these Jacobean motifs. I have Jane Rainbow's "A Beginner's Guide to Crewel Embroidery" - which is very inspirational in this regard. I understand Sue Hawkins & Judy Jeroy's books on crewel are also inspirational in regards to choosing colors for jacobean-style crewel, but I don't have either book yet. (Boo Hoo) I think rather than getting a stand and square frame right now I will concentrate on building my thread and fabric collections (such fun) and of course my book collection. :-) THANKS TO ALL SEWING SUSAN Minnesota |
#17
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Diane Hare wrote:
I'd been embroiderying for 2.5 decades before I ever had a hoop that didn't have spring tension . . . metal with a cork strip. The cork had lost its oomph and wrapping gave a tighter fit. I've no guess how long my mom'd had it before she'd shared it with me. Oh, those were my first hoops as a child. I remember them well. The local store still sells them and I have a few on hand because every once in awhile someone asks for them and I send them on. :-) I got myself a satin-finished wooden hoop then, with a flat spring. I still don't have a tambour hoop that's both nice _and_ tightens with a screw/bolt. Mine tightens with a wing-nut/bolt. Got it at Lacis. But I don't think Lacis sells the wide hoops - only narrower ones, now. A friend asked about the depth (or maybe that was me that asked) and the answer was: "It doesn't make any difference, one holds as well as the other." They're wider than my hand-held German hoop, but not as wide as my present tambour, which is 1-1/4" and holds like a frame would hold. There was also a 2-yard length of doodle fabric with a needle locked in one corner. I'm reminded to never, ever, leave the needle in the fabric. Because of possible rust? I'm amused by this because I have loads of scrap fabric around, all different types, from countable to the finest lawn, all with needle and thread affixed because I will practise on them, or use them for "directions" I'm compiling on the scanner. Some are years old. No problem. I'm figuring how to use a piece of acid-free card-stock and a scrap of fabric to make a needle stash to be held to the corner of the fabric with a couple of stitches, because it is convenient to stall a needle with an incomplete project. That sounds like an interesting device. You'll have to embroider it! Make it of wool felt!! :-) There's already keep a combination folding pliers/screwdriver/etc under a flap in my large needlework bag. I don't need to worry about Hubby snagging it. He has his stuff in the computer jungle area and we both have more in a kitchen drawer. I grin as I consider the _need_ to make a case for the all-in-one-tool to match the scissors case, needle case, eyeglass case, etc. Take a look at my needlework case - under shadow embroidery. I made a "stitcher's necessary" last year (wool embroidery on wool flannel) but haven't promoted it because so few want projects that must be sewn up. Yes, I am also enjoying the discussions. They're a good alternative to more than an hour's stitching on 48-count and to vegging out with DVD's. And what are you stitching on 48-count? As soon as I finish my current project, I want to design another and do it on 45-count fine linen. A drawn fabric piece. Then there's the curtain to finish, the padded silk piece. The stumpwork piece. sigh Dianne |
#18
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sewingsusan wrote:
I confess that I pull on my fabric to get it tight all the time - but I am using heavy linen for crewel embroidery - so that's not such a big deal in my case. It might be a big deal one day. I've ruined a few projects before I learned how to do it so this doesn't happen. Start with the hoop half-way down on the lower hoop. Tighten a little. Square up the fabric so that it is fairly smooth. Tighten the screw again (the top hoop may pop off at this juncture, so start again). THEN: push down the upper hoop. The fabric will stretch itself perfectly. Now use your screwdriver (if you need it drum tight for long periods.) I think the motifs in the Jacobean Iron-On Transfers book are WONDERFUL but I do not care for the colors in the original piece. I have gathered from some reading I have done in the archives that many do not like Jacobean due to the predominate grey and brown colors. I read somewhere that the pieces we have from centuries ago may actually be faded or the dyes have not held up... Actually, I've been doing a bit of reading the last few days on crewel embroidery, because of questions about what needles to use. So I've been referencing several different authors and periods of time. Seems that GREEN was the predominant color, blue came next. If you want more info on this (the reference comes from England from periodicals dating from near the turn of the 19th century to about 1950) I'll grab it and type out more for you. Have fun. Dianne |
#19
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2004 French Mystery Sampler site:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/anne-les-pet...airejardin.htm I'm using dark & medium green, indigo blue, rose & peach silks on salvaged ( :-) as in was-a-shirt-before ) linen shirting. Diane Hare Dianne Lewandowski wrote: Diane Hare wrote: Yes, I am also enjoying the discussions. They're a good alternative to more than an hour's stitching on 48-count and to vegging out with DVD's. And what are you stitching on 48-count? As soon as I finish my current project, I want to design another and do it on 45-count fine linen. A drawn fabric piece. Then there's the curtain to finish, the padded silk piece. The stumpwork piece. sigh Dianne |
#20
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Well, you're a glutton for punishment. :-) That's pretty fine work!
Go girl! Dianne Diane Hare wrote: 2004 French Mystery Sampler site: http://perso.wanadoo.fr/anne-les-pet...airejardin.htm I'm using dark & medium green, indigo blue, rose & peach silks on salvaged ( :-) as in was-a-shirt-before ) linen shirting. Diane Hare Dianne Lewandowski wrote: Diane Hare wrote: Yes, I am also enjoying the discussions. They're a good alternative to more than an hour's stitching on 48-count and to vegging out with DVD's. And what are you stitching on 48-count? As soon as I finish my current project, I want to design another and do it on 45-count fine linen. A drawn fabric piece. Then there's the curtain to finish, the padded silk piece. The stumpwork piece. sigh Dianne |
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