VERY OT !!! RCTN member seeking religious knowledge

"Lucille" wrote in message
...

"Pat EAXStitch" wrote in message
...

"Lucille" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
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If all you want is for this piece to be displayed somewhere it can
actually be seen and appreciated, and still go to the NYFD why not
inquire at their official museum?

http://www.nycfiremuseum.org/index.php

You could frame it nicely, provide a plaque listing designer,
stitchers, and who it is dedicated to and why.

Seems it would fit in better in a museum than in a firehouse, and
this
way it's for all the firehouses that responded that day, not just
one.

Caryn

I really like the idea of the nycfiremuseum and I think she would fit
in
there beautifully. It seems to me that a firehouse wouldn't be the
ideal
place to hang such a delicate piece, what with the grime and soot that
goes
along with the job.

If they aren't interested, I definitely think the money given to the
widows
and orphans fund would be appreciated by all.

Lucille

But-but-but..... there surely shouldn`t be soot in the Firehouse, should
there? That`s one place where there`s unlikely to be a fire. And I
doubt
if they`dchang it in the changing rooms, which would be the only likely
place for soot to fly!

Pat P

Have you ever seen a firefighter when he or she was on the way home from a
fire. I doubt that any room in a firehouse, especially in one that's very
busy like they are likely to be in New York, doesn't have some soot, even
after the firefighters shower and change. Also soot and grime are an
important part of the air you breathe in New York.. The not so funny joke
is that most New Yorkers don't trust any air they can't see. :*)

Lucille

In that case maybe it shouldn`t be in New York at all! And yes - my Dad was
a fireman and served in the London Blitz which on ANY night made the twin
towers pale into insignificance.

Pat P

Lucille wrote:

The not so funny joke
is that most New Yorkers don't trust any air they can't see. :*)




Absolutely not!

Californians grouse about air quality when the sky still looks blue
through the haze. I don't know what they'd do in NYC, where you can cut
the air with a knife.


--
Karen C - California
Finished 5/31/05 - Stars of Merlin wedding sampler

WIP: 50th Anniversary sampler for my parents, July birthstone
LTR: Fireman's Prayer (#2), Amid Amish Life, Angel of Autumn,
Calif Sampler, Holiday Snowglobe

Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher
http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html
blogging at http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Lucretia Borgia wrote:
Elizabeth (giggling over the idea that Sheena could possibly be a sock
puppet for anyone)


You got that right, poor person lol


ROFLMAOWTIMEWPIMP

I may occasionally have the notion of stuffing a sock in Sheena, but a
sock puppet she definitely is not!


--
Karen C - California
Finished 5/31/05 - Stars of Merlin wedding sampler

WIP: 50th Anniversary sampler for my parents, July birthstone
LTR: Fireman's Prayer (#2), Amid Amish Life, Angel of Autumn,
Calif Sampler, Holiday Snowglobe

Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher
http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html
blogging at http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Lucretia Borgia wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jun 2005 23:47:42 GMT, "Pat EAXStitch"
wrote:





In that case maybe it shouldn`t be in New York at all! And yes - my Dad was
a fireman and served in the London Blitz which on ANY night made the twin
towers pale into insignificance.

Pat P


You'm really lookin for trouble me 'andsome! You speak the truth
though, despite being told 9/11 was the single worst disaster, I am
old enough to remember whole cities (like Plymouth) laid to waste. An
ocean of rubble.

Then when we first went to Japan and were on a train to Tokyo which
passed close to Hiroshima, well even I a child of nightly bombings was
mightily impressed with what I witnessed from the window of the train.
I could look and figure out for myself that no children there had gone
out the day after on a foray for shrapnel pieces for their
collections!

Yeah and you, Pat, and I remember such appalling devastation in UK
during WW2.. ( My strongest memory was about 7-8 years old). The sky was
red, and my Dad told me that was London burning.This does not denigrate
the Horror that was suffered in the US on Sept 11. However it is not the
first, or sadly, the last time that evil will prevail.

I think a gift from the heart of people from all walks of life, and
memories would be cathartic!!

I stayed out of the Angel thing, because I had cataract surgery. Two or
three times I asked Victoria to put me on the list of possible
financiers; I would be happy to help with framing expenses. Now the left
eye is iffy!! Not fair!!

I hope the thing finds a perfect home, and my offer still stands to
assist financially with framing and mailing!!
Happy stitching to all

Gillian

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Lucille wrote:
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Pat EAXStitch wrote:
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Lucretia Borgia wrote:
On 13 Jun 2005 13:37:54 -0700, "jv"
wrote:

Just pointing out that anyone who wanted to criticize over
"nastiness"
should check their own behavior first. Then again, who better to
feel
that they recognize nastiness than those who partake in it?

And you'll notice that I haven't tried to lecture *you* on the
fact
that your participation in this thread has been lacking in
positive
and/or constructive content as well.


Now come on, what does Caryn think ???


Good God! Can't let that old lie die???

I think I made it clear what *I* thought earlier.

I'll repeat myself, since you seem to have forgotten:

I think this thread has gotten to be nothing but petty childishness,
from most people involved, Dianne, Victoria, JV, Sharon, Mirjam,
Elizabeth (in the last few hrs), to just name a few.

Grow up already.

Caryn (off to talk to her children, who carry on far more mature
conversations!)

Caryn

LOLOLOL! Well, they did ask for it, Caryn - and your reply was pretty
mild
for you! (duck!!!)

Pat P



I'd been trying to behave, you know? Trying not to sink down to the
level that so many in the thread had reached.

I had mentioned earlier that JV's post seemed to match the rest of the
posts as far as the level of maturity went. I'd been more than willing
to leave that as my last word.

But no....

The old dead horse got dragged out for Sheena to beat on some more. I
used to think she could think for herself, not repeat some pathetic lie
started by someone without any facts, but apparently I was mistaken.

Glad I made you laugh though, Pat!

Caryn

Why do you think that everything is directed at you. Constructive
criticism
isn't a bad thing and I notice that you immediately pick up on the "bad"
things but you never noticed that some of us actually complimented you on
your idea about the NYCFireMuseum.

Methinks you just might just be looking for a little something to fight
about !!!

Lucille



The reason I felt the last thing was directed at me, was because Sheena
mentioned me by name. Hard to come to any other conclusion.

I did notice that you thought my suggestion was a worthy one, but
didn't realize I had to comment again.

I don't really appreciate the accusation that I was looking for a
fight, if you read the posts from today, you'll see that I wasn't one
of the ones sniping just to snipe. I was trying to inject a little
humor as an observer. It's hard to deny that many people were behaving
immaturely.

Caryn

I'm afraid we differ again Caryn--I think you haven't a clue what behaving
immaturely really is and you behave like a spoiled kid. Everything isn't
about you and you really don't have to take everything so personally. Don't
forget, the person who started this project seems to have abandoned it, at
least for now. Those of us who worked on it, or cared so much about it,
don't appreciate the whole thing being thrown away for lack of interest and
have the right to be upset.

L

wrote:


I think this thread has gotten to be nothing but petty childishness,
from most people involved, Dianne, Victoria, JV, Sharon, Mirjam,
Elizabeth (in the last few hrs), to just name a few.

Grow up already.

Before you go telling other people to grow up, Caryn, you might want to
consider that I have carefully avoided addressing you or referring to
you in this forum lately, while you have failed to afford me the same
courtesy. I'm sorry that it doesn't yet appear to have sunk in that
neither I nor anybody else here cares what you think of me. You could
just as easily have left my name out of the above post, but you couldn't
stand to, could you?

Elizabeth
--
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~living well is the best revenge~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
The most important thing one woman can do for another is to illuminate
and expand her sense of actual possibilities. --Adrienne Rich
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Lucille wrote:
wrote in message
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Lucille wrote:
wrote in message
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Pat EAXStitch wrote:
wrote in message
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Lucretia Borgia wrote:
On 13 Jun 2005 13:37:54 -0700, "jv"
wrote:

Just pointing out that anyone who wanted to criticize over
"nastiness"
should check their own behavior first. Then again, who better to
feel
that they recognize nastiness than those who partake in it?

And you'll notice that I haven't tried to lecture *you* on the
fact
that your participation in this thread has been lacking in
positive
and/or constructive content as well.


Now come on, what does Caryn think ???


Good God! Can't let that old lie die???

I think I made it clear what *I* thought earlier.

I'll repeat myself, since you seem to have forgotten:

I think this thread has gotten to be nothing but petty childishness,
from most people involved, Dianne, Victoria, JV, Sharon, Mirjam,
Elizabeth (in the last few hrs), to just name a few.

Grow up already.

Caryn (off to talk to her children, who carry on far more mature
conversations!)

Caryn

LOLOLOL! Well, they did ask for it, Caryn - and your reply was pretty
mild
for you! (duck!!!)

Pat P



I'd been trying to behave, you know? Trying not to sink down to the
level that so many in the thread had reached.

I had mentioned earlier that JV's post seemed to match the rest of the
posts as far as the level of maturity went. I'd been more than willing
to leave that as my last word.

But no....

The old dead horse got dragged out for Sheena to beat on some more. I
used to think she could think for herself, not repeat some pathetic lie
started by someone without any facts, but apparently I was mistaken.

Glad I made you laugh though, Pat!

Caryn

Why do you think that everything is directed at you. Constructive
criticism
isn't a bad thing and I notice that you immediately pick up on the "bad"
things but you never noticed that some of us actually complimented you on
your idea about the NYCFireMuseum.

Methinks you just might just be looking for a little something to fight
about !!!

Lucille



The reason I felt the last thing was directed at me, was because Sheena
mentioned me by name. Hard to come to any other conclusion.

I did notice that you thought my suggestion was a worthy one, but
didn't realize I had to comment again.

I don't really appreciate the accusation that I was looking for a
fight, if you read the posts from today, you'll see that I wasn't one
of the ones sniping just to snipe. I was trying to inject a little
humor as an observer. It's hard to deny that many people were behaving
immaturely.

Caryn

I'm afraid we differ again Caryn--I think you haven't a clue what behaving
immaturely really is and you behave like a spoiled kid. Everything isn't
about you and you really don't have to take everything so personally. Don't
forget, the person who started this project seems to have abandoned it, at
least for now. Those of us who worked on it, or cared so much about it,
don't appreciate the whole thing being thrown away for lack of interest and
have the right to be upset.

L


Not all of this thread revolved around that Angel...

Most of the name calling and truly immature behavior didn't, in fact.

Quite a lot of it revolved around religion, which is alledgely the
subject of the thread. Names were called over the idea of who was
adhering to their relgion and who wanted to trash who over it. At that
point I said I found the name calling immature. If it wasn't, tell me
now!

My suggestion of the Fire Dept Museum was made to the portion of the
thread that dealt with the offshoot subject of the Angel. I thought it
was a reasonable idea, but if the various people who stitched on it
would prefer to keep haggling over every little detail, that's up to
them.

Sure, I'd have preferred for the whole Firehouse Angel thing to have
been kept amongst those actually involved, but that was apparently
never going to happen.

Sheena's and JV's behavior today, the bickering, etc, I did my best to
stay out of, other than the one post in which I said JV's post which
attacked Dianne was at about the same level of maturity as the rest of
the back biting and bickering in the thread. That really would have
been my only comment on their posts.

However.....

Sheena asked "What does Caryn think?" Silly me, I let her bait me into
saying what I thought. Exactly what I thought, about who was acting
like children, I named names. Elizabeth is upset that I named
her...her first post to this thread was to tell Pat she was wrong about
a post containing poor grammar (Pat did manage to show the bit of bad
grammar she was referring to, which Elizabeth didn't comment on), then
later she totally got nasty in Victoria's face about her lack of
stitching input on a project that Victoria had the concept for,
provided the money to purchase materials for, and to the best of my
knowledge (I wasn't involved, so I might be mistaken) organized the
start of. Maybe Vic hasn't stitched on it, but it's not like she
didn't contribute anything at all....altho to read Elizabeth's post
you'd think she hadn't. Elizabeth also had to snipe at JV for her
post, called her nasty....which JV can be, don't get me wrong, but it's
not like Elizabeth's post was pure sweetness and light. Sharon, not
for the first time, got in Victoria's face about being a less than
perfect Buddhist, claiming Vic was always throwing her religion into
our faces...Hello...thread ABOUT religion here...mentioning one's
religion might be expected in this thread! Mirjam got ticked off over
the whole "not an Eastern voice" thing as she claimed, when Vic said it
was in fact a Tibetan monk....more petty name calling ensued from that
as well.

Sheena jumped in today, got in JV's face, JV got in her face...ok,
whatever. But why bring me into it by name?

I'm sure this is more behavior you don't like...my coming out and
reminding you of the truth of what happened in this thread...I really
would have liked for Sheena not to bring my name up...but I can't
control her.

I should control myself better, and this post is just proof that I
can't. That I will defend myself when attacked.

Hope everybody is thrilled...I've given you all days of Caryn Bashing
to come, I'm sure!

Caryn

wrote:

Lucille wrote:

wrote in message
groups.com...


Lucille wrote:

wrote in message
legroups.com...


Pat EAXStitch wrote:

wrote in message
oglegroups.com...


Lucretia Borgia wrote:

On 13 Jun 2005 13:37:54 -0700, "jv"
wrote:


Just pointing out that anyone who wanted to criticize over
"nastiness"
should check their own behavior first. Then again, who better to
feel
that they recognize nastiness than those who partake in it?

And you'll notice that I haven't tried to lecture *you* on the
fact
that your participation in this thread has been lacking in
positive
and/or constructive content as well.


Now come on, what does Caryn think ???


Good God! Can't let that old lie die???

I think I made it clear what *I* thought earlier.

I'll repeat myself, since you seem to have forgotten:

I think this thread has gotten to be nothing but petty childishness,
from most people involved, Dianne, Victoria, JV, Sharon, Mirjam,
Elizabeth (in the last few hrs), to just name a few.

Grow up already.

Caryn (off to talk to her children, who carry on far more mature
conversations!)

Caryn

LOLOLOL! Well, they did ask for it, Caryn - and your reply was pretty
mild
for you! (duck!!!)

Pat P


I'd been trying to behave, you know? Trying not to sink down to the
level that so many in the thread had reached.

I had mentioned earlier that JV's post seemed to match the rest of the
posts as far as the level of maturity went. I'd been more than willing
to leave that as my last word.

But no....

The old dead horse got dragged out for Sheena to beat on some more. I
used to think she could think for herself, not repeat some pathetic lie
started by someone without any facts, but apparently I was mistaken.

Glad I made you laugh though, Pat!

Caryn

Why do you think that everything is directed at you. Constructive
criticism
isn't a bad thing and I notice that you immediately pick up on the "bad"
things but you never noticed that some of us actually complimented you on
your idea about the NYCFireMuseum.

Methinks you just might just be looking for a little something to fight
about !!!

Lucille



The reason I felt the last thing was directed at me, was because Sheena
mentioned me by name. Hard to come to any other conclusion.

I did notice that you thought my suggestion was a worthy one, but
didn't realize I had to comment again.

I don't really appreciate the accusation that I was looking for a
fight, if you read the posts from today, you'll see that I wasn't one
of the ones sniping just to snipe. I was trying to inject a little
humor as an observer. It's hard to deny that many people were behaving
immaturely.

Caryn

I'm afraid we differ again Caryn--I think you haven't a clue what behaving
immaturely really is and you behave like a spoiled kid. Everything isn't
about you and you really don't have to take everything so personally. Don't
forget, the person who started this project seems to have abandoned it, at
least for now. Those of us who worked on it, or cared so much about it,
don't appreciate the whole thing being thrown away for lack of interest and
have the right to be upset.

L


Not all of this thread revolved around that Angel...

Most of the name calling and truly immature behavior didn't, in fact.

Quite a lot of it revolved around religion, which is alledgely the
subject of the thread. Names were called over the idea of who was
adhering to their relgion and who wanted to trash who over it. At that
point I said I found the name calling immature. If it wasn't, tell me
now!

My suggestion of the Fire Dept Museum was made to the portion of the
thread that dealt with the offshoot subject of the Angel. I thought it
was a reasonable idea, but if the various people who stitched on it
would prefer to keep haggling over every little detail, that's up to
them.

Sure, I'd have preferred for the whole Firehouse Angel thing to have
been kept amongst those actually involved, but that was apparently
never going to happen.

Sheena's and JV's behavior today, the bickering, etc, I did my best to
stay out of, other than the one post in which I said JV's post which
attacked Dianne was at about the same level of maturity as the rest of
the back biting and bickering in the thread. That really would have
been my only comment on their posts.

However.....

Sheena asked "What does Caryn think?" Silly me, I let her bait me into
saying what I thought. Exactly what I thought, about who was acting
like children, I named names. Elizabeth is upset that I named
her...her first post to this thread was to tell Pat she was wrong about
a post containing poor grammar (Pat did manage to show the bit of bad
grammar she was referring to, which Elizabeth didn't comment on), then
later she totally got nasty in Victoria's face about her lack of
stitching input on a project that Victoria had the concept for,
provided the money to purchase materials for, and to the best of my
knowledge (I wasn't involved, so I might be mistaken) organized the
start of. Maybe Vic hasn't stitched on it, but it's not like she
didn't contribute anything at all....altho to read Elizabeth's post
you'd think she hadn't. Elizabeth also had to snipe at JV for her
post, called her nasty....which JV can be, don't get me wrong, but it's
not like Elizabeth's post was pure sweetness and light. Sharon, not
for the first time, got in Victoria's face about being a less than
perfect Buddhist, claiming Vic was always throwing her religion into
our faces...Hello...thread ABOUT religion here...mentioning one's
religion might be expected in this thread! Mirjam got ticked off over
the whole "not an Eastern voice" thing as she claimed, when Vic said it
was in fact a Tibetan monk....more petty name calling ensued from that
as well.

Sheena jumped in today, got in JV's face, JV got in her face...ok,
whatever. But why bring me into it by name?

I'm sure this is more behavior you don't like...my coming out and
reminding you of the truth of what happened in this thread...I really
would have liked for Sheena not to bring my name up...but I can't
control her.

I should control myself better, and this post is just proof that I
can't. That I will defend myself when attacked.

Hope everybody is thrilled...I've given you all days of Caryn Bashing
to come, I'm sure!

Caryn

Caryn'

You are so royally screwed up!!!!

I really cannot waste my time bashing people!! My MIL says I hate her,
but honestly, "hate" is for ideals not people. Additionally, I am the
only one in the family who will visit her. (Remember " Gill hates me")


Many of us were involved in the early days of the "Angel" Some like
myself did not have the good eye-sight then to help stitch, but dearly
wanted to be involved. I know that I (and probably others) repeatedly
requested to be allowed to contribute financially to getting the durn
thing framed and sent.

Victoria made this her own "Holy Grail"!!!!

She and I have never got along, simply because our personalities are so
totally different. I try to be nice, but she doesn't appreciate it. She
is gone and hopefully it will remain peaceful here !!!!

I really hope this work of love goes somewhere where it can be
appreciated, and my offer still holds firm. Please let me help
financially with the framing and/or shipping!!

Gillian

wrote:


later she totally got nasty in Victoria's face about her lack of
stitching input on a project that Victoria had the concept for,
provided the money to purchase materials for, and to the best of my
knowledge (I wasn't involved, so I might be mistaken) organized the
start of. Maybe Vic hasn't stitched on it, but it's not like she
didn't contribute anything at all....altho to read Elizabeth's post
you'd think she hadn't.

You shouldn't comment on things you clearly don't understand. I did not
say that Victoria did not contribute to the Angel. I never even implied
such a thing. I did say that she shouldn't be trying to rush other
people's stitching when she didn't take the time to take her own turn
stitching. You wouldn't happen to know who it is that Victoria is
pushing to stitch faster, would you? You should try seeing all sides of
an issue sometime instead of just rushing in to defend the same side all
the time.

Nor was my post "totally nasty." It was really quite mild and simply
suggested that she not fret about things that she can't control. But
you're so hypersensitive that you could take a compliment the wrong way
if it came from someone who had looked at you crosseyed a minute ago,
which is why I really try not to deal with you. I don't understand why
you can't just leave me be when I'm doing my best to leave you be. What
do you expect to gain by naming me or complaining about what I've done?
I'm not going away, so the best you can hope for is that I'll ignore
you. Frankly, I'm beginning to think that you like the drama of
fighting with me. Does it give you an adrenaline rush? Does it make
you feel important? Add punch to your day?

Hope everybody is thrilled...I've given you all days of Caryn Bashing
to come, I'm sure!

Because we've nothing better to do, for sure.

Elizabeth (speaking of childish and petty)
--
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~living well is the best revenge~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
The most important thing one woman can do for another is to illuminate
and expand her sense of actual possibilities. --Adrienne Rich
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

wrote:



I should control myself better, and this post is just proof that I
can't. That I will defend myself when attacked.

and why do you always try to make it seem like any attack on you was
totally unprovoked? You come riding into the fray like a white knight
and then get upset when you get some of your own back. That's just insane.

Elizabeth
--
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~living well is the best revenge~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
The most important thing one woman can do for another is to illuminate
and expand her sense of actual possibilities. --Adrienne Rich
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*