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  #11  
Old October 13th 06, 08:40 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Brock
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default Lurkers Speak!

Oh, I forgot this in my last post.
Have you found those quotes yet, you lying toad?
Keep looking, I'll wait. Brock

You are going to be in trouble with the National Toad Breeder's
Association
if you constantly demean toads by comparing Dennis to one.

Hmmm . . . hadn't considered that.
Okay, I'll call him a lying turd.
Surely turds don't have an association. Brock

PS Found those quotes yet, you lying turd?

Ads
  #12  
Old October 13th 06, 09:39 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 50
Default Lurkers Speak!

Careful, Brock. http://www.funsta.com/turds/ You better Google "turd"
or you could be in deep doo doo.

andy

Brock wrote:
Oh, I forgot this in my last post.
Have you found those quotes yet, you lying toad?
Keep looking, I'll wait. Brock

You are going to be in trouble with the National Toad Breeder's
Association
if you constantly demean toads by comparing Dennis to one.

Hmmm . . . hadn't considered that.
Okay, I'll call him a lying turd.
Surely turds don't have an association. Brock

PS Found those quotes yet, you lying turd?


  #13  
Old October 14th 06, 05:45 AM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Roy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Lurkers Speak!

On 13 Oct 2006 09:45:53 -0700, wrote:


glassman wrote:
I respect your right to lurk, but if each of you would try and become just
a tad more out of the closet, just think of how much more fun this place
would be. Try one post, or better yet one thread start, or one question.
This board is really drying up, and that's the primary reason for the
silliness and OT bashing... there's just not much else to talk about.


--
JK Sinrod
www.SinrodStudios.com
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com


Give some thought to why the lurkers chose to not post.


I started lurking here about a year or so ago when both my wife and I decided we should finally take
up the hobby - we'd talked about it for a couple of years. I have since developed the theory that
just about every person who does much stained glass work is suffering from some sort of severe
personality disorder, perhaps due to lead poisoning.

I signed us up for a class. My wife was very uncomfortable with the ranting and raving of the
instructor, and never came back after the first meeting. I lasted one more session, got our money
refunded, and never went back. A couple of months later, we get this flyer from the guy, saying
he's going to do only contract work, is selling off his stock and will never teach another class
again. It seems he only had enough people to field a single class in 2005, 5 of the 6 people did
not complete it. Evidently, if everyone was not gong to be grateful, well, he'd take his ball and
go home.

I've read many complaints here about lack of new students, lack of sales, etc over the last year or
so. Hey, if you treat your customers like this guy did, how can you be surprised that no one wants
to do business with you. I see the same childish rants, raves, personal attacks and foul attitudes
all over this newsgroup. It's a shame, because I still think this could be an interesting hobby.
But there are many, many other hobbies out there that are just as interesting and rewarding, and
they don't seem to come with the abuse heaped on people like the instructor we had, or the unmerited
verbal attacks that are commonplace in this newsgroup.

I pull headers here once a week or so. If Carol(?) in Turkey has a post in a thread, I tend to pull
the bodies for those headers. There is frequently something I can learn from a thread she
participates in, because it takes longer, usually, for the hate-mongers here to ruin it.. Most of
the rest I will just spot check to see if there is any substance to it, or kill it if has descended
into the typical 6-year-old level of name calling that seems to be 90% of the posts.

Why don't lurkers post? Probably because they see the virulent, antisocial attitudes dumped on the
group by two or three people on a very regular basis. My belief is that many potential beginners
are probably nearing retirement age, certainly have disposable income, but are totally turned away
by the vulgar abuse that appears to me to permeate the hobby, at least as it is represented in
rec.crafts.glass.

Since I have never before in my life found such a pocket of mean-spirited people by nature, I must
assume that many of the frequent posters here are suffering from some form of lead poisoning that is
causing these asocial attitudes and behavior. I mean, what do you guys do, hold all the solder in
your mouths all day long, week after week or something?

My thanks to the few courteous, helpful people who occasionally post here. Those few are the sole
reason I still lurk here, and have not completely given up on the hobby. But I will probably never
consider spending any serious money on it again - perhaps just a time-killer some rainy weekend.

I also lurk over at rec.woodworking, where almost always even a clueless newbie will get helpful
responses and even friendly answers to honest, even pretty stupid newbie type questions. RWW is
the most helpful newsgroup I have followed. The help and advice I got there convinced me to pry
open my wallet a couple months back and spend a couple of grand for a new cabinet saw. In more than
a year following this group, I have not seen anything posted that begins to induce me to spend even
a tenth that much, ever again, on the SG hobby.

Listen up you retailers and suppliers. Y'all are killing off the golden goose with all your
infighting. You'd have a lot more lurkers here, and potential customers too, if this wasn't a group
dominated by a few pathetic people.

Ok, flame away. I've even dropped every twit filter I've had in this group to make sure I see every
argument refuting this post. I really want to hear the logic as to how ranting, raving,
name-calling, insults and veiled threats brings people into the hobby. Maybe you'll convince me
that common courtesy and respect are a waste of time. I doubt it, but fire away.

Regards,
Roy
  #14  
Old October 14th 06, 06:01 AM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Glassman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Lurkers Speak!


"Roy " put an "RP" here to reply wrote in message
...
On 13 Oct 2006 09:45:53 -0700,
wrote:


Ok, flame away. I've even dropped every twit filter I've had in this
group to make sure I see every
argument refuting this post. I really want to hear the logic as to how
ranting, raving,
name-calling, insults and veiled threats brings people into the hobby.
Maybe you'll convince me
that common courtesy and respect are a waste of time. I doubt it, but
fire away.

Regards,
Roy


You can choose to be as thin skinned as you like Roy. This is usenet, and
there's no one here to breakup the fights or punish the bad boys. This goes
on in every group I've ever read, from computers to health topics. As far as
I know there's only one poster that gets constantly attacked here whenever
he pops up. I think you're assuming it happens to everyone. Not true. As for
your bad class experience... don't judge an entire profession by one bad
teacher. That would be very silly indeed. I've taught 1000's of folks and
have not had one refund request in over 25 years. I can't tell you how many
really bad teachers I had in my public school days. If I took your advice, I
would have quit school before I was 10 years old. See no flames.


--
JK Sinrod
www.SinrodStudios.com
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com


  #15  
Old October 14th 06, 06:06 AM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Glassman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Lurkers Speak!


wrote in message
ups.com...

glassman wrote:
I respect your right to lurk, but if each of you would try and become
just
a tad more out of the closet, just think of how much more fun this place
would be. Try one post, or better yet one thread start, or one question.
This board is really drying up, and that's the primary reason for the
silliness and OT bashing... there's just not much else to talk about.



Give some thought to why the lurkers chose to not post.


Still waiting to hear about how many of your students that have taken your
advice, have successful money making glass businesses running today. What
percentage of your students that you teach turbo soldering, and anti 3 tier
system buying are making a living doing the kiln work you talk about? In my
25 years of teaching 1000's of students, I could count on one hand the ones
that are making a living at it.


--
JK Sinrod
www.SinrodStudios.com
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com


  #17  
Old October 14th 06, 02:44 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Javahut
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 79
Default Lurkers Speak!


"Roy " put an "RP" here to reply wrote in message
...
Give some thought to why the lurkers chose to not post.


I started lurking here about a year or so ago when both my wife and I

decided we should finally take
up the hobby - we'd talked about it for a couple of years. I have since

developed the theory that
just about every person who does much stained glass work is suffering from

some sort of severe
personality disorder, perhaps due to lead poisoning.

I signed us up for a class. My wife was very uncomfortable with the

ranting and raving of the
instructor, and never came back after the first meeting. I lasted one

more session, got our money
refunded, and never went back. A couple of months later, we get this

flyer from the guy, saying
he's going to do only contract work, is selling off his stock and will

never teach another class
again. It seems he only had enough people to field a single class in

2005, 5 of the 6 people did
not complete it. Evidently, if everyone was not gong to be grateful,

well, he'd take his ball and
go home.

I've read many complaints here about lack of new students, lack of sales,

etc over the last year or
so. Hey, if you treat your customers like this guy did, how can you be

surprised that no one wants
to do business with you. I see the same childish rants, raves, personal

attacks and foul attitudes
all over this newsgroup. It's a shame, because I still think this could

be an interesting hobby.
But there are many, many other hobbies out there that are just as

interesting and rewarding, and
they don't seem to come with the abuse heaped on people like the

instructor we had, or the unmerited
verbal attacks that are commonplace in this newsgroup.

I pull headers here once a week or so. If Carol(?) in Turkey has a post

in a thread, I tend to pull
the bodies for those headers. There is frequently something I can learn

from a thread she
participates in, because it takes longer, usually, for the hate-mongers

here to ruin it.. Most of
the rest I will just spot check to see if there is any substance to it, or

kill it if has descended
into the typical 6-year-old level of name calling that seems to be 90% of

the posts.

Why don't lurkers post? Probably because they see the virulent,

antisocial attitudes dumped on the
group by two or three people on a very regular basis. My belief is that

many potential beginners
are probably nearing retirement age, certainly have disposable income, but

are totally turned away
by the vulgar abuse that appears to me to permeate the hobby, at least as

it is represented in
rec.crafts.glass.

Since I have never before in my life found such a pocket of mean-spirited

people by nature, I must
assume that many of the frequent posters here are suffering from some form

of lead poisoning that is
causing these asocial attitudes and behavior. I mean, what do you guys

do, hold all the solder in
your mouths all day long, week after week or something?

My thanks to the few courteous, helpful people who occasionally post here.

Those few are the sole
reason I still lurk here, and have not completely given up on the hobby.

But I will probably never
consider spending any serious money on it again - perhaps just a

time-killer some rainy weekend.

I also lurk over at rec.woodworking, where almost always even a clueless

newbie will get helpful
responses and even friendly answers to honest, even pretty stupid newbie

type questions. RWW is
the most helpful newsgroup I have followed. The help and advice I got

there convinced me to pry
open my wallet a couple months back and spend a couple of grand for a new

cabinet saw. In more than
a year following this group, I have not seen anything posted that begins

to induce me to spend even
a tenth that much, ever again, on the SG hobby.

Listen up you retailers and suppliers. Y'all are killing off the golden

goose with all your
infighting. You'd have a lot more lurkers here, and potential customers

too, if this wasn't a group
dominated by a few pathetic people.

Ok, flame away. I've even dropped every twit filter I've had in this

group to make sure I see every
argument refuting this post. I really want to hear the logic as to how

ranting, raving,
name-calling, insults and veiled threats brings people into the hobby.

Maybe you'll convince me
that common courtesy and respect are a waste of time. I doubt it, but

fire away.

Regards,
Roy


Whoa, Roy, had a fresh batch of coffee, did we?

First off, where is the world did you get the idea that Usenet was here to
promote hobbyists? Does it say that in the charter? This group is here to
discuss glass and its creation as regards to a craft. Nobody on here gives
2 rips if you spend 10 grand on tools, for glass or wood, nor should they be
impressed by your ability to do so.

2nd, this is where I vent on stupidity, in the glass world or elsewhere, if
I so chose to do so, and I also offer up little tidbits of my experience in
working with glass. If you don't like that, or don't chose to read it, or
use it, GREAT, good for you, and your right to do so..

If you got a bum teacher, then I bet his commission work sucks too, and he
probably isn't there anymore unless he is so impressed with his own work
that his trust fund allows him to remain.

Don't confuse the attitude of people here with what it is in real life, this
is a place for alter egos to come out. Of course a person can't vent like
this in their classroom, then people like you would do what you did. And
rightly so.
I taught in the system for 12 years, Adult Ed, stained glass, to people who
wanted to be there, they paid, they bought supplies, and I had alot of
people that would take the class that knew what they were doing, because we
had a good time and alot of laughs. No one got physically hurt, they built
what they wanted and learned from not only what they did, but what others
did. Even though at that time I had a retail supply store, I taught the
classes with cutter, grozing pliers, straight edge and soldering iron as the
major tools. NO grinders, no sales pitches, just learn. NO ONE EVER ASKED
FOR THEIR MONEY BACK, 12 YEARS

So what does that have to do with what goes on here? NOT 1 THING, that is
my point.

Why should I give a rip what you spend on a glass hobby in Houston? Doesn't
effect me in Michigan, not at all. even if you were visiting here and
needed a sq ft of Glue chip. Cause I don't sell it. You really believe
that people involved with glass as a profession care if there are more
hobbyists? not particularly, the hobbyist is the person sitting on a church
committee that is building a new church and knows so much about glass that
they are determined to make sure they don't get "ripped off" by the stained
glass professional giving a presentation, and asks why the bid is so high.
They understand just enough about stained glass to get themselves in
trouble.

Good job Roy, brought me out of my summer sleep, its getting cold here now,
got to park the bike and spend more time here, aren'tcha glad?


  #18  
Old October 14th 06, 05:02 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
C Ryman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 42
Default Lurkers Speak!

Hi Roy,
Just my 2 cents worth but shouldn't you just get a hobby that you really
really enjoy?
I don't do glass because of other people. I just think glass is fascinating
even if my own work is not that great.

--
Connie Ryman
Cryman Studio

"Roy " put an "RP" here to reply wrote in message
...
On 13 Oct 2006 09:45:53 -0700,
wrote:


glassman wrote:
I respect your right to lurk, but if each of you would try and become
just
a tad more out of the closet, just think of how much more fun this place
would be. Try one post, or better yet one thread start, or one
question.
This board is really drying up, and that's the primary reason for the
silliness and OT bashing... there's just not much else to talk about.


--
JK Sinrod
www.SinrodStudios.com
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com


Give some thought to why the lurkers chose to not post.


I started lurking here about a year or so ago when both my wife and I
decided we should finally take
up the hobby - we'd talked about it for a couple of years. I have since
developed the theory that
just about every person who does much stained glass work is suffering from
some sort of severe
personality disorder, perhaps due to lead poisoning.

I signed us up for a class. My wife was very uncomfortable with the
ranting and raving of the
instructor, and never came back after the first meeting. I lasted one
more session, got our money
refunded, and never went back. A couple of months later, we get this
flyer from the guy, saying
he's going to do only contract work, is selling off his stock and will
never teach another class
again. It seems he only had enough people to field a single class in
2005, 5 of the 6 people did
not complete it. Evidently, if everyone was not gong to be grateful,
well, he'd take his ball and
go home.

I've read many complaints here about lack of new students, lack of sales,
etc over the last year or
so. Hey, if you treat your customers like this guy did, how can you be
surprised that no one wants
to do business with you. I see the same childish rants, raves, personal
attacks and foul attitudes
all over this newsgroup. It's a shame, because I still think this could
be an interesting hobby.
But there are many, many other hobbies out there that are just as
interesting and rewarding, and
they don't seem to come with the abuse heaped on people like the
instructor we had, or the unmerited
verbal attacks that are commonplace in this newsgroup.

I pull headers here once a week or so. If Carol(?) in Turkey has a post
in a thread, I tend to pull
the bodies for those headers. There is frequently something I can learn
from a thread she
participates in, because it takes longer, usually, for the hate-mongers
here to ruin it.. Most of
the rest I will just spot check to see if there is any substance to it, or
kill it if has descended
into the typical 6-year-old level of name calling that seems to be 90% of
the posts.

Why don't lurkers post? Probably because they see the virulent,
antisocial attitudes dumped on the
group by two or three people on a very regular basis. My belief is that
many potential beginners
are probably nearing retirement age, certainly have disposable income, but
are totally turned away
by the vulgar abuse that appears to me to permeate the hobby, at least as
it is represented in
rec.crafts.glass.

Since I have never before in my life found such a pocket of mean-spirited
people by nature, I must
assume that many of the frequent posters here are suffering from some form
of lead poisoning that is
causing these asocial attitudes and behavior. I mean, what do you guys
do, hold all the solder in
your mouths all day long, week after week or something?

My thanks to the few courteous, helpful people who occasionally post here.
Those few are the sole
reason I still lurk here, and have not completely given up on the hobby.
But I will probably never
consider spending any serious money on it again - perhaps just a
time-killer some rainy weekend.

I also lurk over at rec.woodworking, where almost always even a clueless
newbie will get helpful
responses and even friendly answers to honest, even pretty stupid newbie
type questions. RWW is
the most helpful newsgroup I have followed. The help and advice I got
there convinced me to pry
open my wallet a couple months back and spend a couple of grand for a new
cabinet saw. In more than
a year following this group, I have not seen anything posted that begins
to induce me to spend even
a tenth that much, ever again, on the SG hobby.

Listen up you retailers and suppliers. Y'all are killing off the golden
goose with all your
infighting. You'd have a lot more lurkers here, and potential customers
too, if this wasn't a group
dominated by a few pathetic people.

Ok, flame away. I've even dropped every twit filter I've had in this
group to make sure I see every
argument refuting this post. I really want to hear the logic as to how
ranting, raving,
name-calling, insults and veiled threats brings people into the hobby.
Maybe you'll convince me
that common courtesy and respect are a waste of time. I doubt it, but
fire away.

Regards,
Roy



 




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