looking for a specialty clay recipe

I have a need to mix some nonhardening clay, as dense and stiff as
possible.

I've tried google searches and the library without success, and some
experiments with clay and vegetable oil, etc., haven't done well
either. (They weren't "sticky" enough, I don't know the technical
term.)

Can anyone offer some advice? or direct me to a forum for a better
answer, or maybe a text?

I know what I want is possible, because there are some commercial
products out there, but they are not available in my location.
Besides, it's more fun to make your own.

TimR wrote:

I have a need to mix some nonhardening clay, as dense and stiff as
possible.

I've tried google searches and the library without success, and some
experiments with clay and vegetable oil, etc., haven't done well
either. (They weren't "sticky" enough, I don't know the technical
term.)

Can anyone offer some advice? or direct me to a forum for a better
answer, or maybe a text?

I know what I want is possible, because there are some commercial
products out there, but they are not available in my location.
Besides, it's more fun to make your own.


Tim, I think if you gave a bit more information, as to what you want
to do with it, where your location is, it might be easier to answer your
question.

Monika

--
Monika Schleidt

www.schleidt.org/mskeramik
(If you wish to send me a mail, please leave out the number after my name!)

sounds like he wants a "plastacine" type clay. the kind they sell in laguna
clay or aardvark. it never hardens, and hand heat softens the clay.

i "grew up" with plasticine from around 3 years old till maybe 14. my mom used
it to stab fake flowers into vases. once i knew where she "kept" the stuff,
flowers never seemed to stay upright in vases anymore...

in my earlier pyromaniac days when i was realizing heat made the clay softer i
kept some clay on top of our heater. eventually i held some over a candle
thinking it might be a way to soften it faster.

i found out the stuff can burn!

i figured it's a petrolium oil based material... or maybe like that old chewy
candy wax we used to buy in the 60's.

see ya

steve







Subject: looking for a specialty clay recipe
From: Monika Schleidt
Date: 3/25/2004 10:35 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: lekom.at



TimR wrote:

I have a need to mix some nonhardening clay, as dense and stiff as
possible.

I've tried google searches and the library without success, and some
experiments with clay and vegetable oil, etc., haven't done well
either. (They weren't "sticky" enough, I don't know the technical
term.)

Can anyone offer some advice? or direct me to a forum for a better
answer, or maybe a text?

I know what I want is possible, because there are some commercial
products out there, but they are not available in my location.
Besides, it's more fun to make your own.


Tim, I think if you gave a bit more information, as to what you want
to do with it, where your location is, it might be easier to answer your
question.

Monika

--
Monika Schleidt

www.schleidt.org/mskeramik
(If you wish to send me a mail, please leave out the number after my name!)









steve graber

"TimR" wrote in message
om...
I have a need to mix some nonhardening clay, as dense and stiff as
possible.

I've tried google searches and the library without success, and some
experiments with clay and vegetable oil, etc., haven't done well
either. (They weren't "sticky" enough, I don't know the technical
term.)

Can anyone offer some advice? or direct me to a forum for a better
answer, or maybe a text?

I know what I want is possible, because there are some commercial
products out there, but they are not available in my location.
Besides, it's more fun to make your own.

How about this?
http://users.lmi.net/~drewid/plastilene_recipe.html

gotta love Google.
-nancy-

Thanks for the site to the plastiline recipe.

Monika pointed out I didn't give much information on my intended use.

So, with some embarassment that it isn't truly a craft project, here
it is.

Target shooters who use airguns need a safe backstop to stop their
pellets (most practice in the basement or garage between
competitions.) There are many solutions but most have two problems:
they are very noisy from the impact of the pellet, and they do not
trap the lead dust.

Pellet traps using a putty material are silent and since they are
sticky, trap all the lead without emitting any lead dust. The most
common product used in the US is Ductseal, found in the electrical
department of your local home building store. It is used to keep fire
from following the wires in an electrical conduit. It is gray, very
stiff and dense, the trade term is "thumbgrade". The MSDS says
calcium carbonate and binder. I've also used a commercial pipeline
valve sealant, made of kaolin and vegetable oil per the MSDS. Neither
are available where I live now. I have also tried floral clay,
plumbers putty, play dough, and weatherstripping compound. None have
the necessary strength, the pellet blows right through them without
slowing much, although floral clay is better than the others. Duct
seal is about $3.00 US per pound, so any solution in that range or
better would be welcome to airgunners even where Ductseal is
available. 10 pounds will fill most target holders.

Per the plastilene recipe: Microcrystalline wax is pretty expensive,
but likely something cheaper can be used since this can be pretty
rough? How do you vary proportions for harder clays - less binder?
Different clay powder?

"TimR" wrote in message
om...

Per the plastilene recipe: Microcrystalline wax is pretty expensive,
but likely something cheaper can be used since this can be pretty
rough? How do you vary proportions for harder clays - less binder?
Different clay powder?

Paraffin can be picked up rather cheaply at Craft supply shops, ball clay is
cheap but since you're not a sculptor you can probably just use dirt from
the yard. I'd sift it to get out rocks and twigs. I'll bet you can recycle
used motor oil for the engine oil.
Take the recipe I found and mess around with it.

good luck
-nancy-

On 26 Mar 2004 04:39:49 -0800, (TimR) wrote:

Thanks for the site to the plastiline recipe.

Monika pointed out I didn't give much information on my intended use.

So, with some embarassment that it isn't truly a craft project, here
it is.

Target shooters who use airguns need a safe backstop to stop their
pellets (most practice in the basement or garage between
competitions.) There are many solutions but most have two problems:
they are very noisy from the impact of the pellet, and they do not
trap the lead dust.

Pellet traps using a putty material are silent and since they are
sticky, trap all the lead without emitting any lead dust. The most
common product used in the US is Ductseal, found in the electrical
department of your local home building store. It is used to keep fire
from following the wires in an electrical conduit. It is gray, very
stiff and dense, the trade term is "thumbgrade". The MSDS says
calcium carbonate and binder. I've also used a commercial pipeline
valve sealant, made of kaolin and vegetable oil per the MSDS. Neither
are available where I live now. I have also tried floral clay,
plumbers putty, play dough, and weatherstripping compound. None have
the necessary strength, the pellet blows right through them without
slowing much, although floral clay is better than the others. Duct
seal is about $3.00 US per pound, so any solution in that range or
better would be welcome to airgunners even where Ductseal is
available. 10 pounds will fill most target holders.

Per the plastilene recipe: Microcrystalline wax is pretty expensive,
but likely something cheaper can be used since this can be pretty
rough? How do you vary proportions for harder clays - less binder?
Different clay powder?

OK, I have to ask this: What's wrong with the old-time
tried-and-true stack of old magazines? Cheap, readily
available, decent sound deadening, and will stop anything
you want.... just use a thicker stack. I recall my Dad
using these in his basement range with .22 pistol, many
years ago. I don't recall how he held them in place, but
I'm pretty sure the slugs entered face-on to the pages,
not edge-on.

Just a thought.


Bob Masta
dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom

D A Q A R T A
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com

(Bob Masta) wrote in message ...
snip

OK, I have to ask this: What's wrong with the old-time
tried-and-true stack of old magazines? Cheap, readily
available, decent sound deadening, and will stop anything
you want.... just use a thicker stack. I recall my Dad
using these in his basement range with .22 pistol, many
years ago. I don't recall how he held them in place, but
I'm pretty sure the slugs entered face-on to the pages,
not edge-on.

Just a thought.


Bob Masta
dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom

D A Q A R T A
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com

Bob,
This does work but is not the elegant solution. With a low powered
springer the noise of the pellet hitting the backstop seems about
twice the noise of the airgun firing. With the clay/putty material
traps there is no impact noise at all so 2/3 of your noise is gone.
The shredded paper and loose pellets don't pile up on the floor,
either. There are other solutions such as angled plates that bounce
the pellet straight down, etc. None control lead dust like the soft
products can. See this for an example:
http://www.babymd.net/aa_improved_si...ellet_trap.htm

And thanks again for all the help, I'll play with that recipe. Any
idea why the valve sealant used kaolin instead of a cheaper ball clay?

Hi Tim:

I use the plasticine clay from this company:

http://www.kleanklay.com/

They ship in 50lb cases for about $67.50 US shipping included.
You can order it in soft to extra firm. I use the firm for bronze
sculpture. Nice for detail, but stiff enough to give your hands
a real work out. I have not "experienced" the extra firm, but
it might be just what you are looking for. It comes in individually
wrapped 1lb blocks or I think they will send you one big unwrapped
50lb block. Just stack a couple of these on top of each other
and away you go.

Diego

"TimR" wrote in message
om...
(Bob Masta) wrote in message
...
snip

OK, I have to ask this: What's wrong with the old-time
tried-and-true stack of old magazines? Cheap, readily
available, decent sound deadening, and will stop anything
you want.... just use a thicker stack. I recall my Dad
using these in his basement range with .22 pistol, many
years ago. I don't recall how he held them in place, but
I'm pretty sure the slugs entered face-on to the pages,
not edge-on.

Just a thought.


Bob Masta
dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom

D A Q A R T A
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com

Bob,
This does work but is not the elegant solution. With a low powered
springer the noise of the pellet hitting the backstop seems about
twice the noise of the airgun firing. With the clay/putty material
traps there is no impact noise at all so 2/3 of your noise is gone.
The shredded paper and loose pellets don't pile up on the floor,
either. There are other solutions such as angled plates that bounce
the pellet straight down, etc. None control lead dust like the soft
products can. See this for an example:
http://www.babymd.net/aa_improved_si...ellet_trap.htm

And thanks again for all the help, I'll play with that recipe. Any
idea why the valve sealant used kaolin instead of a cheaper ball clay?

"Diego" wrote in message .. .
Hi Tim:

I use the plasticine clay from this company:

http://www.kleanklay.com/

They ship in 50lb cases for about $67.50 US shipping included.
You can order it in soft to extra firm. I use the firm for bronze
sculpture. Nice for detail, but stiff enough to give your hands
a real work out. I have not "experienced" the extra firm, but
it might be just what you are looking for. It comes in individually
wrapped 1lb blocks or I think they will send you one big unwrapped
50lb block. Just stack a couple of these on top of each other
and away you go.

Diego

Thanks, that might be exactly what I was looking for, and the kids can
use it for their art projects too.

I don't suppose you happen to have an airgun handy and could shoot a
block, just to see how deep it went? grin A 50 pound block would
probably work for firearms, but be overkill for an airgun. We're
looking for something stiff enough to stop a pellet in 1/4 inch to 1/2
inch depending on power.