Yoohoo, Mommies!

Dr. Brat wrote:

I'd be willing to bet that your original statement didn't differentiate
because it didn't occur to you to differentiate. But don't let that
inconvenient fact get in your way.


Now you're reading my mind?

No, my original statement didn't differentiate because the statistic I
recalled seeing didn't differentiate between
rich/poor/black/white/educated/illiterate. The statistic I recalled
simply said that the age group as a whole was less likely to own
computers than any other age group, and all the statistics cited in this
discussion have borne that out. I didn't try to extrapolate anything
out of that statistic other than what I recalled it saying, "age group
as a whole".



Yup. I think that people have agreed with that, and the conversation
was never really about all people 65 and over anyway, was it? It was
about the grannies who attend your craft fair.


Correct. The initial conversation was about that particular group,
which from personal observation on my part skews toward the older end of
the over-65 age range, and are frugal enough with their money that
they're not going to buy a computer just to keep up with the Joneses. I
know these people, have talked to these people one-on-one, I know how
they think, and for anyone to tell me that because their friends in
Florida or Halifax are online, these people are too, is clearly an
assumption based on knowing nothing at all about the people I'm talking
about.

In countering that assumption based on Sheena and Lucille's friends, I
did say that I recalled a statistic (didn't recall the exact number)
that the over-65 crowd is "least likely to own a computer". Every
statistic cited has borne me out, and none of those statistics were
provided by me.



But can we go back and talk about the people likely to attend your craft
fair and your blanket statement that they wouldn't be online? Are you
seriously arguing that they're more like your parents than they are like
Sheena and Lucille? If that's the case, couldn't you have just said so
and avoided all this hubbub instead of making blanket statements about
grannies everywhere?


The only blanket statement I made about grannies everywhere was that
they are the age group "least likely to own a computer". All the prior
statements were about this particular group of grannies who will be
attending this particular event. I am saying that ethnically, age-wise,
financially, and in their thought-processes about purchasing a computer,
they are very much like my parents, who are older than Sheena and Lucille.

I have no doubt that I could talk them into dropping $5 on a dress for
Barbie, a toy they recognize and which has endured (even if it has lost
some following recently).

I have serious doubt that I could convince them to buy anything, even
for $2, for "what's a webkin?", a fad toy that may be obsolete two days
after Christmas.

As stated, Mavia's attempt at explanation -- had I not already followed
Cheryl's link -- would have simply reinforced my notion that this is a
critter that exists only in cyberspace and therefore it's a complete
waste of money to buy it clothes that exist in the 3-D world. And if I
don't totally understand the thing myself, I can't explain it to someone
who's not as computer-savvy as Sheena/Mavia/Lucille and who is also
naturally skeptical of anyone trying to get them to part with their
money. Just the word "web", in that crowd, will raise the spectre of
scams, because they're the type who fear what goes on online, and would
make it an even harder sell than if the same toy was named Beanie Babies
or Cabbage Patch Kids.

Younger/hipper grannies like Sheena/Mavia/Lucille might be an easier
sell, but that's not descriptive of the clientele at this event. There
are more 80-somethings than 60-somethings in attendance, and I would not
be exaggerating to call a lot of them "old stick in the muds". I have
(see prior posts) called them "tightwads".

--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Dawne Peterson wrote:
And it would take a lot more than a mere snowstorm to slow Sheena down.



Absolutely. But someone who is not as young and healthy a senior as
Sheena -- someone has difficulty enough walking on flat/dry surface
without trying to navigate snow and ice -- will be homebound by a snowstorm.

My great-aunt, who was certainly as spunky as our Sheena in spirit,
broke a hip and on doctors' orders no longer ventured out when there was
snow on the ground. After a big enough blizzard, she'd stay home for
days to avoid the chance of further injury.

Had she lived in California, she never would have had to skip her church
meetings because of snow, because we never have any.

That was all the point I was trying to make: that in Sheena's part of
the world, there are people who don't get out much in winter because of
weather, where we don't have the same hazards here, and therefore,
there's not the same need to seek out online companionship because we're
never snowed in and isolated.


--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Dawne Peterson wrote:

Our weather here
might strike Karen's neighbours in California as horrible



And vice versa. Canadians look at us like we're nuts when we go out in
100 degrees to play softball, and say (with a straight face) "cooling
trend to 108".

I have, absolutely deadpan, asked for a sweater in 85 degrees, because
the day before, when I left here, it was almost 30 degrees hotter and I
really was cold among all these people who swore they were sweating to
death.

--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Jangchub wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 09:37:32 +1000, Trish Brown
wrote:

Jangchub wrote:

snip

I think is one, another "Kath
and Kim" where thongs are out with those F me backtoos. It just gets
worse and worse.
I agree with you wholeheartedly on this, but *please* don't dismiss
'Kath and Kim' until you've watched it just once.

snip

This show is new here and stars Molly Shannon. Is this the same show
with American actors? Or the same show, just new here?

I will watch it only because I love Molly Shannon from Saturday Night
Live. I hope it's good. Not much seems to be very good these days.

v

Ooooh! Dunno! Shouldn't open me big gob until I know of what I speak! It
sounds as though it might be an American version of the Oz show. I can't
*imagine* how it would translate, though, because as I said the humour
is very Australian. Let me know what it's like, will you? I'd be
interested to know.

Trish Brown wrote:

I can't
*imagine* how it would translate, though, because as I said the humour
is very Australian.


Based on your recommendation, I'm willing to give it a try, after
rolling my eyes at the stupidity of the promos and dismissing it as
unworthy of my time. Since I know your tastes in entertainment reflect
functioning brain cells, I trust you not to steer me toward truly
mindless fluff with no socially redeeming value!



--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

The Uncyclopedia is a handy unreference for many things. For example:

Crochet - http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Crochet

Knitting - http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Knitting

Barbie - http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Barbie

Beanie Babies http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Beanie_Babies

There is no entry for Webkinz but you can help to rectify this omission
http://uncyclopedia.org/index.php?title=Webkinz&action=edit

--
Bruce Fletcher
Stronsay, Orkney UK
http://preview.tinyurl.com/3b54af

Dawne Peterson wrote:

"Karen C in California" wrote

Well, their word of mouth seems to have failed to reach Mom's
social circle or mine. None of the grannies she asked had any clue
about them.


Before I started working at the book store last August, I wouldn't
necessarily been very savvy about them, not because they weren't
around in lots of stores, but because to someone not especially
interested, they look like another cute stuffed toy.


Precisely. It is possible that both Mom's social circle and mine have
walked past them in a store and because none of the kids we knew had
asked for them, did just walk right past.

I do, however, prowl every inch of my favorite card stores, know their
stock almost as well as the employees, and can say with near 100%
certainty that the places where I buy most of my greeting cards do not
stock Webkinz.

I've never been much of a mall rat, even as a teenager, so I know that I
have not been in every store in town. Mom and her friends spend a lot
more time in malls than I do, though, and buy more toys for more kids,
so if Webkinz are so ubiquitous, it is far more surprising that they're
all completely unaware of them than that I am clueless.

--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Bruce Fletcher (remove dentures to reply) wrote:


There is no entry for Webkinz



Oh, good, even an online informational site that doesn't know about
them! I'm starting to feel less out of the loop.



--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/

Jangchub wrote:

That's why I asked if this was the same version. Maybe I'm getting to
GOWly, but I really can't stand to see young women with those thongs
out the back with that tatoo on the small of the back which my husband
calls a slut brand like they brand cattle.

I'm afraid I can't find them attractive at all. This is difficult,
because both my DNieces *and* my Ugly Sister have got them. When they
showed me the new inks, I was expected to gush over their great beauty
and I *couldn't*! It was awful! At least they don't have thongs hanging
out the back, which is something.

Oof, so rank and some of the local girls ARE like Trish described with
the back fat flubbing out and their bellies hanging over the top of
their lowrider jeans and if they bend over an inch full crackage. The
worst things we did as kids was to run around with halter tops made of
a bandana and no bras!


Hee! There's a woman and her two daughters who used to sit in front of
us at Mass. All three wore low-rider jeans and as soon as they sat down,
we would be presented with what my DMum termed 'three letter-boxes'. She
kept daring me to insert my folded parish bulletin into one of them, but
I couldn't! Neither could she, of course, the chicken! I often wish I'd
taken a photo to demonstrate what a cluster of crax looks like in
panorama...

Don't speak too loudly about what *we* did! Compared to my parents'
expectations of what was 'ladylike', I was a holy terror with my
see-through cheesecloth shirts tied up under the (braless) bust! My poor
Mum nearly fainted when I suggested I wanted my jeans to have a front
fly instead of a side-fastening! You'd think I'd asked for a tatt or a
genital piercing! And the weeny bikinis, compared to Mum's nice
one-piece *with a modesty panel* - that was going to take me directly to
h*ll without passing 'Go'!

It's all relative. My precious-darling-baby-love daughter is nearly
fourteen. I've had to re-think my opinions more than once on the way and
I'm sure I will again, many times. Kids today live in a different world
from the one we grew up in (in which we grew up) and we parents have to
be flexible enough to allow them to find their way into the future.
Fashion fads are horribly threatening when one is looking in from the
outside, but I think it's all part of the normal process (horrendous as
some of the fads might appear to me).

I reckon it's pointless 'forbidding' kids from taking part in things
that are fashionable. Part of the growing up is learning from the fads
that come and go. Joining a fad is one of the necessary social skills to
a kid. Learning to dismiss the fads is an even more necessary one and it
happens when the kid is 'old enough', whenever that might be.
Thankfully, my DD and I share most of the same tastes, although she's
annoyingly less adventurous than I'd like her to be.

One technique I've found useful is to ask 'Would you like one of those?'
when a new fashion comes in. We go shopping, try the stuff on and she
gets to decide if it looks good or not. Thus far (and it's only very
early days, I know!) she listens when I say 'That makes your bum look
fat' or whatever. The day isn't far off, though, when her opinions
become wholly her own and that's the day I look forward to. After all,
I'm trying to raise a good adult, not a good kid.

Since she's that bit older and widening her circle of friends, I've had
the chance to meet lots and lots of younger folk through school and
Scouts. And y'know, they're all pretty great kids. You get the odd few
who are destructive and stupid, but not so many. Not enough to be
depressed about, I guess. The way I look at it, the stupid and
destructive ones will not be energetic and motivated enough to make
serious differences when the political decisions get made by this
upcoming generation. The good ones, even if they're in the minority,
will be the ones who make the best difference. Call me 'Pollyanna', but
that's my take on it all. I hope I'm right!

Dr. Brat wrote:

But you'll spend six hours defending yourself from someone with no
ulterior motive who simply misunderstood you rather than take the time
to compose your post more carefully in the first place.


I thought there was nothing to misunderstand about "statistically,
people over age 65 are least likely to own computers." If anyone
misunderstood that simple declarative sentence, it has more to do with
their reading skills than my writing skills.

As far as spending 6 hours on it, I had no paying work today, and spent
most of the day hanging around waiting for DBF to be finished with his
appointment of indeterminate length. Dinner was to be leftovers from
yesterday, so I had nothing better to do while I was waiting for him
than to try to clear up the misunderstandings and misquotations that
resulted in the attacks.

I am scheduled to have work coming in tomorrow, and therefore, will not
have another 6 hours to spend explaining that I said what I said, and I
did not say what other people said.

--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

Finished 7/27/08 - MLI Christmas Visit

WIP: Oriental Kimono (Janlynn), MLI The Teacher (gift to
the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://journals.aol.com/kmc528/Lifeasweknowit/