Dear Red States

Jangchub wrote:

The part I don't understand in Karen's statement is that she says all
her friends are men, but then will say something about men holding her
back.


I didn't say all men were my friends.

Most men will say what they mean, which I find preferable to the women
(and I could name lots of names over the decades) who will play
nicey-nice to your face and then stab you in the back.

If a man is not going to treat me fairly, more often than not, he'll say
it to my face so I can walk away without wasting any more time on him
(or his class or his job interview). None of this female notion that
it's acceptable behavior to pretend to be my friend, and then tattle to
the boss or steal my boyfriend or tell everyone else how much she hates
me (and then the next time I see her, pretend she's my friend and act
shocked that someone told me what she really thinks about me).

The male professor was upfront about it "30 points of your grade is
based on classroom participation", i.e., you will get a maximum of 70
points for your A+ exam if he doesn't call on you. After we were told
he never calls on women and confronted him, he was again very upfront
about his sentiments that we should go home and have babies, we had no
place in his classroom. OK, the rules of the game are clear, when you
get a D after writing an A exam you can't claim you thought he'd see
reason after he read your brilliance, as opposed to those professors who
said "a portion of your grade is based on class participation" and you
were left guessing how much is "a portion".

--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

"On his tombstone, Benjamin Franklin wanted it said not that he had been
rich
but rather that he had been useful."

Finished 10/7/08 - Sun Fun (Dimensions)

WIP: Nativity from "Countdown to Christmas" book, Oriental Kimono
(Janlynn),
MLI The Teacher (gift to the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://cfs-facts.blogspot.com/

Ericka wrote:

Jangchub wrote:

On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 10:26:41 -0600, Olwyn Mary
wrote:


I lived for twelve years in a college town. I couldn't count the
number of kids who had to do an extra year because they changed
majors halfway through. As a result, I ALWAYS tell entering freshers
to "take the smorgasbord" and not declare a major until junior year.


What's wrong with doing an extra year?


Nothing, if you can afford to do it! The cost
is staggering at many universities, however.

Best wishes,
Ericka


Yep. And some scholarships are limited to four years. There was no way
that I was going back for a fifth year after the big scholarship ran
out, so I had to finish in four years, or else. The student loan on its
own was nowhere near enough to cover the cost.


--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

"On his tombstone, Benjamin Franklin wanted it said not that he had been
rich
but rather that he had been useful."

Finished 10/7/08 - Sun Fun (Dimensions)

WIP: Nativity from "Countdown to Christmas" book, Oriental Kimono
(Janlynn),
MLI The Teacher (gift to the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://cfs-facts.blogspot.com/

wrote:

On Nov 18, 2:01 am, Karen C in California wrote:

And as much as she whined about
the unfairness of me getting the extra money for working on her case,
the next time overtime came up, she didn't want to give up her Saturday,
so guess who got rich at her expense again?

Actually, we don't agree. I try really hard to be respectful of women
who make other choices than I do, but you seem to have nothing but
contempt for any of them. It's not a matter of "giving up her
Saturday." It's a matter of having put her children before her job,
for which she was to be commended, not condemned.



Her choice. But if she's going to put her children before her job, then
she shouldn't complain that I got paid for working "her" overtime.

I got the extra money because I did the extra work. I had every right
to tell the office manager "No, I have plans, make her do her own damn
overtime".

The person who gives up her Saturday gets the extra money. The person
who doesn't want to give up her Saturday, regardless of reason, has no
right to complain that it's "unfair" that she didn't get the extra money.


--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

"On his tombstone, Benjamin Franklin wanted it said not that he had been
rich
but rather that he had been useful."

Finished 10/7/08 - Sun Fun (Dimensions)

WIP: Nativity from "Countdown to Christmas" book, Oriental Kimono
(Janlynn),
MLI The Teacher (gift to the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://cfs-facts.blogspot.com/

wrote:

If you were in litigation, how is it that you continue to claim that
as a paralegal you could do everything the lawyers could do, when
that's clearly not the case?


Only two things I couldn't do: sign my own name to pleadings and sit
first chair at trial. I could write the pleadings (and rubber stamp
someone else's signature on them without him even reviewing them) and I
could sit second chair.



--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

"On his tombstone, Benjamin Franklin wanted it said not that he had been
rich
but rather that he had been useful."

Finished 10/7/08 - Sun Fun (Dimensions)

WIP: Nativity from "Countdown to Christmas" book, Oriental Kimono
(Janlynn),
MLI The Teacher (gift to the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://cfs-facts.blogspot.com/

On 11/18/08 8:40 PM, in article ,
"Jangchub" wrote:

On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 11:46:19 -0800 (PST), lewmew
wrote:

I think another reason kids are pressured to declare a major early is
so they can get the classes they need! For example (completely
fictional), if you want a degree in Zoology, you probably need to take
certain biology and chemistry classes, some of which build on one
another and others of which are only offered every other semester. At
some universities, you may not even be able to take Zoology 101 until
you've had those courses and since they are the basis for all science
majors, they fill up fast. If you wait, you may not be able to get
into them when you would have preferred to. Others, you can't take
until you declare your major. If you don't declare soon, you can't
graduate in four years.

Linda

That's right. Matriculation seems to be difficult without a major. At
least here it is.
Victoria

There is now a major called "Interdisciplinary Studies". It seems to consist
of taking a minor's worth of courses in several subjects with or without
having to take seminar work or a senior project to unify your studies.
Chester College (two towns over) has it.

http://www.chestercollege.edu/academ...D=26#academics



Cheryl
Framed a diploma once for Interdisciplinary Studies with the listed
specialties of Pop Art, Economics and Old English.

Jangchub wrote:
On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 21:06:59 -0500, Ericka
wrote:

Jangchub wrote:
On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 10:26:41 -0600, Olwyn Mary
wrote:
I lived for twelve years in a college town. I couldn't count the number
of kids who had to do an extra year because they changed majors halfway
through. As a result, I ALWAYS tell entering freshers to "take the
smorgasbord" and not declare a major until junior year.
What's wrong with doing an extra year?
Nothing, if you can afford to do it! The cost
is staggering at many universities, however.

It is, but if it means that or a drop out, concessions need to be
made. UT Austin I believe costs almost 400 a credit hour, plus
housing plus food. I know. But like I said, if it is done to prevent
disinterest in college it may be worth it. That's all I'm saying. I'm
really pro-college.

Even at the cost of leading students to believe
that everything will be hunky dory, even if they leave
with student loan debt out the wazoo and few job prospects?
I'm all for ivory tower academics (that's my natural
inclination), but sadly, that's a luxury not everyone can
afford. I think students have to make a realistic
assessment of their own situations and the consequences
of choosing the various options open to them.

One thing I learned at college is the fallacy of
sunk costs ;-) What you have already invested in college
is not particularly relevant to the decision of whether to
continue to go to college. What is relevant is whether
the investment you are considering making in taking the
*next* semester of college will have a result that is
worth the investment. We all have a different calculus
for evaluating the worth of the investment, with the
costs including not only money but also time and other
missed opportunities, and the benefits including not only
potential wages but also knowledge and skill and opened
doors, but ultimately, even if you've already invested
four years, it doesn't necessarily follow that it makes
sense to invest another year or more.

I looked it up, and estimated total cost for
one year at UT-Austin for an in-state undergrad living
on campus is about $21-25K. Unless you're well-heeled
to begin with, that's a lot of cash for each extra year.
And that's fairly reasonable tuition. It's much worse
at some other schools. I dearly hope my kids go to
college. That's the expectation, and that's what we're
working towards. Nevertheless, if they graduate high
school and aren't ready to do something more at college
than meander about having a fun experience, then I'll be
encouraging them to get a job until they have a tad more
focus, perhaps sampling some courses in the mean time to
figure out what floats their boat academically. I have
rarely seen a good outcome from someone going to college
before they're ready. That doesn't mean they have to
know precisely what they want to study and have their
whole college career planned to the nth degree, but if
they're not even ready to do some significant exploring,
work hard, and develop some academic discipline, then
they're not going to get much out of college, and tens
of thousands of dollars is a bit much to pay for a nice
setting in which to party, in my opinion. I'll knock
myself out to get my kids to college, but they'll have
to earn it on their end too.

Best wishes,
Ericka

On Nov 19, 9:37 am, Jangchub wrote:
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:27:42 -0500, Cheryl Isaak

wrote:
There is now a major called "Interdisciplinary Studies". It seems to consist
of taking a minor's worth of courses in several subjects with or without
having to take seminar work or a senior project to unify your studies.
Chester College (two towns over) has it.

http://www.chestercollege.edu/academ...D=26#academics

Cheryl
Framed a diploma once for Interdisciplinary Studies with the listed
specialties of Pop Art, Economics and Old English.

Now that sounds like a fair idea. More schools should catch on to
this way of thinking.

Very few schools HAVEN'T caught on to that idea. My mother earned a
BA in Liberal Studies from the University of Delaware in 1976 (at the
age of 56).

Elizabeth

On 11/19/08 11:32 AM, in article
,
" wrote:

On Nov 19, 9:37 am, Jangchub wrote:
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:27:42 -0500, Cheryl Isaak

wrote:
There is now a major called "Interdisciplinary Studies". It seems to consist
of taking a minor's worth of courses in several subjects with or without
having to take seminar work or a senior project to unify your studies.
Chester College (two towns over) has it.

http://www.chestercollege.edu/academ...D=26#academics

Cheryl
Framed a diploma once for Interdisciplinary Studies with the listed
specialties of Pop Art, Economics and Old English.

Now that sounds like a fair idea. More schools should catch on to
this way of thinking.

Very few schools HAVEN'T caught on to that idea. My mother earned a
BA in Liberal Studies from the University of Delaware in 1976 (at the
age of 56).

Elizabeth



I'll bet her degree was a lot more structured than what is being done today.
And had a few papers to write...
C

Jangchub wrote:

He didn't go to university and now he earns three hundred
dollars an hour in NY as a union plumber! More than most doctors make
and no malpractice insurance burden.



I wish I'd had that story last year when a doctor's wife was dissing
anyone who doesn't go to college as being a low-income loser the rest of
their life.

I had the one side of the story (my over-educated ex who chooses to work
for just over minimum wage) to prove that college doesn't guarantee a
good income, but nothing concrete on the other side to prove that
college isn't required to make a good living.


--
Karen C - California
Editor/Proofreader www.IntlProofingConsortium.com

"On his tombstone, Benjamin Franklin wanted it said not that he had been
rich
but rather that he had been useful."

Finished 10/7/08 - Sun Fun (Dimensions)

WIP: Nativity from "Countdown to Christmas" book, Oriental Kimono
(Janlynn),
MLI The Teacher (gift to the library), Bethany Angel (Marbek)
Retrieved from UFO pile: Marbek's Snow Angel, MLI Farmers Market

CFSfacts -- where we give you the facts and dispel the myths
Myths, with research cites: http://www.aacfs.org/images/pdfs/myths.pdf
Newest research blog: http://cfs-facts.blogspot.com/

On Nov 19, 2:57 pm, Cheryl Isaak wrote:
On 11/19/08 11:32 AM, in article
,
" wrote:

Very few schools HAVEN'T caught on to that idea. My mother earned a
BA in Liberal Studies from the University of Delaware in 1976 (at the
age of 56).

I'll bet her degree was a lot more structured than what is being done today.
And had a few papers to write...

I think you'd lose that bet. Her degree was based on a program she
proposed herself that was approved by a committee, which is exactly
what happens at the institution at which I currently teach.

Elizabeth