Dear Red States

Elizabeth wrote

(snip)
It's so easy to stand outside someone else's life and judge their
choices, but all that does is show the personality flaws of the one
doing the judging. Lest this get thrown back at me, allow me to say
that it's one thing to judge someone's choices and quite another to
judge their expectations once they've made those choices. I don't,
for example, think that people who choose to have children should
expect to be as advanced in their careers as people who don't have
children and therefore have more time to devote to career-building.
I'm not one who thinks that any of us can "have it all."

I often think how lucky your students are! The difference between making
choices and dealing with the consequences of having made those choices was
so well stated.
Thanks
Dawne

On Nov 16, 1:55 pm, "Dawne Peterson" wrote:
Elizabeth wrote

(snip)
It's so easy to stand outside someone else's life and judge their
choices, but all that does is show the personality flaws of the one
doing the judging. Lest this get thrown back at me, allow me to say
that it's one thing to judge someone's choices and quite another to
judge their expectations once they've made those choices. I don't,
for example, think that people who choose to have children should
expect to be as advanced in their careers as people who don't have
children and therefore have more time to devote to career-building.
I'm not one who thinks that any of us can "have it all."

I often think how lucky your students are! The difference between making
choices and dealing with the consequences of having made those choices was
so well stated.
Thanks

Thank you!

I'm very lucky because I have great students and a job that suits me
quite well. Took a while to get here, but I truly enjoy what I do
most days.

Elizabeth

On Nov 16, 2:19 pm, lucretia borgia
wrote:
On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 10:47:42 -0800 (PST),
opined:



Wow. I think that a person could just as easily argue that it is
selfish to have children as it is not to have them. In any case, I do
believe that people who don't want children shouldn't be expected to
have them. What kind of parent would a person be who didn't want to
be one in the first place?

I don't think either Dawne or I meant that - I meant that certain
'expectations' are levelled where women are concerned.

Oh, I didn't think either you or Dawne meant that. I was responding
to a comment that Dawne quoted someone as having made to her friend.

It's so easy to stand outside someone else's life and judge their
choices, but all that does is show the personality flaws of the one
doing the judging. Lest this get thrown back at me, allow me to say
that it's one thing to judge someone's choices and quite another to
judge their expectations once they've made those choices. I don't,
for example, think that people who choose to have children should
expect to be as advanced in their careers as people who don't have
children and therefore have more time to devote to career-building.
I'm not one who thinks that any of us can "have it all."

As a mother and a woman, I kind of agree with you but only because the
mother side of me feels that while the children are young either the
mother OR the father must devote a large quantity of time to them. If
one of the parents is not prepared to do that, then they are not
prepared to have children. One can't have it all. BTW I know one

I'm not a mother, but this was pretty much my point and why I edited
my post to say "people" instead of women. I don't think it has to be
the mother, but I think one parent has to be willing to make children
the absolute priority when they are young. It's part of why I think
that committed gay couples should be allowed to adopt, especially if
one partner is willing to be a full time caretaker - children need
that kind of attention and often don't get it in foster or group homes
(please note, I said "often.")

family where the father is just getting back to work, he has done a
stupendous job of raising the two daughters and her career is soaring.
Financially she makes more than he could ever have done and I truly
believe he made a better 'mother' than she would ever have done. Win,
win.

Bingo.

Elizabeth

wrote in message news:168922d3-b416-41d6-a64b-
I was raised in a good Irish Catholic home and I was always encouraged
to excel academically and to follow my career path of choice.

Liikewise! My parents encouraged me towards higher education of some sort so
that I would always be able to support myself - and my family should
circumstances require it. And they have, so I am very grateful for what I
consider some of the best advice of my life.
I also come from a line of working women - my "Nana" was a full-time teacher
in the days when no-one else's grandmother, that I knew, worked outside the
home.

The
Catholic Church in the late 20th century has much to answer for, but
papal statements against women working outside of the home isn't one
of its sins.

Agreed! The problems that some of us women had in med school, or, more
often, as trainee specialists, in the 70s and early 80s, were entirely
related to the old boy network and had nothing to do with any church.

Eimear

The best response to unkind and overly curious questions is a quiet "If
you will forgive for not answering, I will forgive you for asking."

Pat in Illinois

Pat in Illinois wrote:
The best response to unkind and overly curious questions is a quiet "If
you will forgive for not answering, I will forgive you for asking."

Pat in Illinois

I just LOVE that.....and at my mature age, I sure as heck can get away
with it! Better than "None of your business, *&()&**.

Gillian

wrote:
Lest this get thrown back at me, allow me to say
that it's one thing to judge someone's choices and quite another to
judge their expectations once they've made those choices. I don't,
for example, think that people who choose to have children should
expect to be as advanced in their careers as people who don't have
children and therefore have more time to devote to career-building.
I'm not one who thinks that any of us can "have it all."

Thank you for speaking for a lot of women. I will add: those who think
they can "have it all" are more than likely neglecting something:
either career or children.

Dianne



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lucretia borgia wrote:
On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:15:05 GMT, Gillian Murray
opined:

Pat in Illinois wrote:
The best response to unkind and overly curious questions is a quiet "If
you will forgive for not answering, I will forgive you for asking."

Pat in Illinois
I just LOVE that.....and at my mature age, I sure as heck can get away
with it! Better than "None of your business, *&()&**.

Gillian

Sheesh, I thought it was meant for the question "When do you plan on
starting a family" - bit late Gillian eh what ? We are GOWS, I just
say, None of your ####### business lol

It applies to *ANY* inappropriate question....you old GOW yourself!

Maybe I should say, crying, " I lost little Ralphie last month!".

Gill

You can have it all, you just can't have at all at the same time.

Pat in Illinois



Dianne Lewandowski wrote:
wrote:
Lest this get thrown back at me, allow me to say
that it's one thing to judge someone's choices and quite another to
judge their expectations once they've made those choices. I don't,
for example, think that people who choose to have children should
expect to be as advanced in their careers as people who don't have
children and therefore have more time to devote to career-building.
I'm not one who thinks that any of us can "have it all."

Thank you for speaking for a lot of women. I will add: those who think
they can "have it all" are more than likely neglecting something: either
career or children.

Dianne

It seems to me that today young people, even/especially women, have many more
choices and opportunities than my generation had. Typically, a female could go
to college and study to be a teacher or a nurse but even better than a BA or a
BS was an Mrs.
--
another anne, add ingers to reply