The Dying SG Retail Store

Dennis Brady wrote:

Look harder. Glass isn't the only product sold. =A0None of the over 100
artisans we supply care where we're listed. =A0Adapt or die. =A0While the
old style retailers are dying off, cooperative businesses like mine are

being born.

What I'm saying is that based on your website of supplies, you are
calling yourself a wholesaler. Yet, none of the general manufacturers
(Spectrum, BE and many others don't recognize you as a wholesaler
because they don't sell directly to you. Claiming to be a wholesaler
when in fact you actually buy from distributors like most of us, is in
essence leading your customers along by making them think that they are
really getting a wholesale price when they are actually getting a
discounted retail price. If these customers of yours are able to meet
your buying requirements then theya re able meet the requirements of
most wholesaler...they probably just don't know who these wholesalers
are.

Andy

wrote:
Dennis Brady wrote:

Look harder. Glass isn't the only product sold. �None of the over 100
artisans we supply care where we're listed. �Adapt or die. �While the
old style retailers are dying off, cooperative businesses like mine are

being born.

What I'm saying is that based on your website of supplies, you are
calling yourself a wholesaler. Yet, none of the general manufacturers
(Spectrum, BE and many others don't recognize you as a wholesaler
because they don't sell directly to you. Claiming to be a wholesaler
when in fact you actually buy from distributors like most of us, is in
essence leading your customers along by making them think that they are
really getting a wholesale price when they are actually getting a
discounted retail price. If these customers of yours are able to meet
your buying requirements then theya re able meet the requirements of
most wholesaler...they probably just don't know who these wholesalers
are.

Andy


BE will sell directly to anybody which may add to the problem.

--
Jack

Plonked by Native American

bobo1148atxmissiondotcom


http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/xmissionbobo/

Interesting how nobody but retailers care what I call myself. I sell
to mostly working artisans whose only concern is price and service.
In the past year I've helped 7 customers create new retail shops. They
don't care either.

It does however seem to bother you what I call Victorian Art Glass.
That's something I don't care about.

=A0 Jun 16, 5:11=A0pm =A0 =A0 show options
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.glass
From: - Find messages by this author
Date: 16 Jun 2005 14:11:56 -0700
Local: Thurs,Jun 16 2005 5:11=A0pm
Subject: Was: The Dying SG Retail Store, Is: long winded
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Interesting how nobody but retailers care what I call myself. =A0I sell
to =A0mostly working artisans whose only concern is price and service.
In the past year I've helped 7 customers create new retail shops. =A0They

don't care either.

It does however seem to bother you what I call Victorian Art Glass.
That's something I don't care about.

My point is that you continually put down small local retailers with
your constant "Adapt or die" theory. You seem to think that we all are
out there gouging folks and ripping them off. You clump us all into one
pot. Every segment has it's bad apples...wholesalers as well. However,
there are a lot more good ones than bad ones. I don't know if you seem
to have "it in" for us or what but in all the years I've been on this
NG and other forums, I've never heard you once praise the small mom and
pop shop. I work hard to make a living and I do my best to treat my
customers fair and give them what deem a fair price. If you think I'm
gouging them and ripping them off then screw you.

Andy

"Kalera Stratton" wrote in message
news:2vydndylzolnACzfRVn-
Why are you so unpleasant to people who don't do windows? Did you know
that there's a stained glass newsgroup, where you wouldn't have to dealw
ith us awful beadmakers?
--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

Uhhh..I'm only unpleasant to folks that have it coming. Like cross-posting
whiners like yerself.

"Kalera Stratton" wrote in message
...


Moonraker wrote:
wrote in message If that's the case then why
don't
you leave the retail sales of rods

and such up to the retailer and do what you do...make beads. It's
competition like you (rods and such you are selling on your site) that
make the competition tough for retailers...big or small. Everybody
wants a slice of the pie but the pie is only so big.

Andy


There are only a few reasons I can think of to support a national sales
tax,
and one of them is to clamp down on the basement bandits. Maybe these
internet low-lifes wouldn't be so anxious to be cutting prices and
services
if they had to compete on a level playing field, one where they
actually
had to report their sales and pay income taxes like the rest of us.

At least with a national sales tax, whenever they spent the profits in
a
retail store, they'd actually be paying some taxes, for a change.

I pay income and self-employement taxes, you vile little spooge. Every
penny of my income is reported.

--
-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com

If you check above, you will see that my comments were to Andy. Not to
you. So **** off.

For many years I've been telling people their first choice for supplies
should be their local shop BUT if they can't get satisfactory prices
and services from the local retailer, they should shop the internet.
I not only support small retailers, I help create them. I'm working
right now with 2 artisans looking to expand their business base by
selling supplies. I suggest supporting local retailers, but if the
local retailer fails to provide fair pricing or adequate service, they
don't deserve support.

You appear to think warm glass is a passing fad. I think you're
completely wrong and expect the market for stained glass supplies to
continue to diminish while that for warm and hot glass supplies to
correspondingly increase. Shop owners that recognize this and
diversity to meet the new market realities will not only survive,
they'll thrive.

I'd suggest that if you're incapable of conducting a civil debate
without resorting to personal insults, I'm probably wasting my time
discussing anything with you. I'm posting instead for others to read
in the hope that others (with better manners) might benefit.

wrote:

If that's the case then why don't you leave the retail sales of rods
and such up to the retailer and do what you do...make beads. It's
competition like you (rods and such you are selling on your site) that
make the competition tough for retailers...big or small. Everybody
wants a slice of the pie but the pie is only so big.

Andy

Kinda funny story - I once went into a Corvallis OR retail glasss shop.
They had some nice pieces, but the glass selection sucked eggs, and
the prices weren't that great either. Going to Portland was really the
only option if I wanted nice glass and decently-priced supplies. I
bought from these folks a couple of times, but then stopped.

The service was certainly OK, but not stellar, not good enough to go
back time and again.

Now I get all my supplies on the 'net, and get my glass in Seattle or
Portland, because it's hard to buy glass without seeing the piece
you're buying, unless it's a sort of uniform glass (glue-chip,
hammered, etc.) Those kinds of glass I'll buy on the 'net as well. I
don't have to deal with snotty or know-it-all sales folks, I can shop
in my underwear at 11:35PM, and I don't have to walk any further than
my door to pick it up. Convenience. Price is a close second.

If store-front retail wants to succeed, complaining about e-tail
doesn't get them any closer to success.

E.P. (Flat-panel foil-n-solder type guy.)

wrote:

If that's the case then why don't you leave the retail sales of rods
and such up to the retailer and do what you do...make beads. It's
competition like you (rods and such you are selling on your site) that
make the competition tough for retailers...big or small. Everybody
wants a slice of the pie but the pie is only so big.

Andy

Kinda funny story - I once went into a Corvallis OR retail glasss shop.
They had some nice pieces, but the glass selection sucked eggs, and
the prices weren't that great either. Going to Portland was really the
only option if I wanted nice glass and decently-priced supplies. I
bought from these folks a couple of times, but then stopped.

The service was certainly OK, but not stellar, not good enough to go
back time and again.

Now I get all my supplies on the 'net, and get my glass in Seattle or
Portland, because it's hard to buy glass without seeing the piece
you're buying, unless it's a sort of uniform glass (glue-chip,
hammered, etc.) Those kinds of glass I'll buy on the 'net as well. I
don't have to deal with snotty or know-it-all sales folks, I can shop
in my underwear at 11:35PM, and I don't have to walk any further than
my door to pick it up. Convenience. Price is a close second.

If store-front retail wants to succeed, complaining about e-tail
doesn't get them any closer to success.

E.P. (Flat-panel foil-n-solder type guy.)

wrote in message
oups.com...
For many years I've been telling people their first choice for supplies
should be their local shop BUT if they can't get satisfactory prices
and services from the local retailer, they should shop the internet.
I not only support small retailers, I help create them. I'm working
right now with 2 artisans looking to expand their business base by
selling supplies. I suggest supporting local retailers, but if the
local retailer fails to provide fair pricing or adequate service, they
don't deserve support.

You appear to think warm glass is a passing fad. I think you're
completely wrong and expect the market for stained glass supplies to
continue to diminish while that for warm and hot glass supplies to
correspondingly increase. Shop owners that recognize this and
diversity to meet the new market realities will not only survive,
they'll thrive.

I'd suggest that if you're incapable of conducting a civil debate
without resorting to personal insults, I'm probably wasting my time
discussing anything with you. I'm posting instead for others to read
in the hope that others (with better manners) might benefit.


It seems to me to be somewhat counterproductive for "local artisans" to
begin selling supplies to other locals who are already competitors. If a
badly operated store is in the area already, certainly they've failed more
than one or two local artisans. So, one of them decides to go into
competition with the existing store, and, in order to get some immediate
return on his investment, begins to cut prices and make deals and solicit
business from his studio's competition. And so the downward spiral widens.
You now have two stores that aren't performing.

I agree with you that if local retailers don't perform, they should be
passed over. However, a busy existing custom studio expanding off into
retailing supplies seems to be the exception, not the norm. The custom
studios I know are so busy that they can barely keep up with their high
margin workload, muchless devote any time to low margin, low volume glass
sales. In fact, it seems to me the trend is exactly opposite. Those
studios with a retail arm are closing down the retail operation, at least
from what I can see and read.

While warm or hot glass supplies are on the uptrend and cold glass is
certainly taking a nosedive, what I haven't heard is what the "headcount"
in the market is? Are we talking about the same general group of people
who took the cold glass class at the local retailer, advanced to
intermediate or expert, and are now looking for new horizons? Or is the
market for hot glass supplies a basically new population that has never done
cold glass? What are your gang of artisans doing to expand the market base?
Or do we have an increasing number of diversified artisans/part-time
retailers trying to sell supplies to the same finite number of customers?
The pie can only be sliced so many times before it's time to make another,
larger, pie. What exactly is your solution to that?