On 1/2/04 6:43 PM,"Karen C - California" posted:

In article , Ellice writes:

it is the LNS that are hurting. The proliferation of web-shopping has done
that.

Not necessarily. I had a fantastic LNS some years ago. Unfortunately, they
were only open one evening per week, and not on Sunday. About a block away
was
a chain craft store, open every evening and all day on Sunday. For those of
us
who were at work during 90% of the LNS' open hours, the chain store was far
more convenient, and cheaper, too.

That is a big competition - but not for those buying painted canvas, or many
designer charts. The chains carry lots of kits, but not so much of the
higher end (for lack of a better term) material. Point blank - floss sales
don't profit the LNS - most have to sell it at very close to cost, with a
surprisingly low mark-up. It's there as you must have it for needlework. The
chain stores, OTOH, can sell it at ridiculously low prices without hurting -
they can afford it as a loss leader - it gets you in the store. And their
quantity price is likely lower than the individual LNS prices.

that's worked for 100 years. Unfortunately, what worked in the 1950s when
most
women were home during the day does not work in the 2000s when most women are
at work downtown during the day.

Sure, and smart shop owners find a way to accommodate with hours that work
for working clients.

The shop owners complain about WalMart stealing their business, without ever
considering how much additional business they could do if they were open the
same hours as WalMart. I have to go out of my way to get to a WalMart, but I
do *not* have to use precious vacation time to get there. If there were
someplace in my neighborhood that I could buy this stuff after 6 PM, I'd shop
in my neighborhood, but since the shops in my neighborhood are telling me they
only want the business of people who don't work, I'll go to a store that
accommodates my schedule.

That's sad, that you feel your local shops only want business of non-working
folks. But, it pays for WalMart to be open, as they're not selling a
specialty item only. Few folks just go to Wal Mart at 8:30 to buy some floss
alone. When the LNS is open really late - we've found few folks really want
to come shop then. They're tired - we might get browsers, but...In my
friend's shop, we're open til 6 W and Fri, til 7 Tues & Thur, til 5 Sat &
Sun. In this case, closing on Mondays let's the owner have some time off,
and also do commercial work (framing) that may take her out of the shop. We
do get a lot of people in the shop between 4:30 and 6:00 - and people know
what days we're open til 7. But, point blank - it's not worth staying open
later to just sell some floss. It seems that being open past most office
closing times works pretty well. And having the weekend hours. The LNS
nearer my house - she's open 7 days a week - and opens at 9:30, closing at
5:30, except the 2 nights she's open til 7:30. The monthly stitch night,
the shop is essentially open - so people do come in and shop occasionally.
Mostly - either we're in there - or it's browsers - there's a Safeway a few
storefronts down.

I appreciate that the LNS owner has a family and she'd like to be home with
them in the evening, but she needs to realize that businesses operate for the
convenience of the customers, not for the convenience of the owners. If we
can't get there during her open hours, it's easier for us to find someplace
that will serve us when we can shop, than to change our schedules to
accommodate her. I've been mail-ordering for decades because by the time I
get
home from work, cook, clean up after dinner, and have time to shop, that's the
only option that's available to me. Pre-dated substantially even the first
beginnings of the internet.

Essentially you prove part of my point. Mail order, web-order - serious dent
in the LNS. For many working people - me when I was working - I did shopping
on the way home from work - to make the 6 or 7 pm closing time. I might be
stopping for a coffee to take with me - but that was the option. I don't
know how a shop owner can stay in business and be successful if they're
doing it for their own convenience. But, you also have to really figure out
what the cost-benefit of staying open late, or later is. Some shops open
late on a particular day to have a late shopping night. Heck, the skate
place we use does that - they open at 12 2 days a week to stay open til 9,
and are closed on Mon, Tues - because they're a zoo on the weekends -open
from 8-8.

I umderstand people using alternatives to LNS. Just pointing out some of
what has contributed to their business difficulties, as opposed to assuming
Needlework in general is declining.

ellice